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Is Turtling a bad they does it lessen gains.

When I start healing like wolverine I will start using an anti-turtling device. I just don’t think that much healing occurs within 21 hours of my session.

Don’t get me wrong if there was an absolutely easy way to apply something or bandage things up that doesn’t require explaining if an embarrassing intimate moment happens or a bathroom moment happens I would probably use it. But I don’t want to be thinking about PE 24 hours out of the day. I don’t want the constant thinking of hoping someone doesn’t catch me with something on my penis.

I will confess I did try some bandage device earlier in my career. I could always feel it. I needed to adjust it throughout the day. I definitely had to use the bathroom stall instead of a urinal. I definitely wouldn’t want to explain it to my spouse. One time I didn’t put it on good or my being a grower caused it to fall off into my boxers. I could just imagine it falling to the ground when I picked up my kids at school.

I kept on asking myself is thing really doing anything at all.

For me it wasn’t worth it. I have definitely gained without it. I also can’t help but think that one extra hanging set will do more for me than something that produces almost no tension at all.


12/11/2013 BPEL 5 3/4 NBPEL 5 1/16 BPFSL 6 1/16 NBPFSL 5, EG Base 5 EG Mid 4 7/8 EG Below Glans 4 3/4

11/02/15 BPEL 7 1/8”, BPFSL 8 1/16”, EG Mid 5 1/4 —- Goals BPEL 7 1/2”, NBPEL 6 1/2", BPFSL 9” Motivational Resources Wanted

8/9/2014 259 lbs ---- 11/2/15 248 lbs 33.2% body fat Bhcentral's Progress Reports and Pictures

Originally Posted by bhcentral
In regards to the original posters question of lessening gains we really don’t know if turtling lessens gains. People gain on both sides whether or not they do something to prevent it.

From reading all the posts from Bib he basically says when you hang that first set the following day you pull what has been trying to heal out. You are basically undoing that effect within minutes of that first hang. I am guessing his theory would apply to other methods also. Remember this is just his theory.

I have been juggling in my head this thing of tension and time as a X,Y graph for awhile. Mainly thinking about the difference between extending and hanging but even in the context of hanging only. Comparing the results of hardcore hanging versus the 10 hours a week plus that the rest do. Just trying to think if there is some point that is the absolutely most effective weight and time. My guess is the point is dynamic depending on where you are in your PE career. However, I am sure most of us aren’t even close to this maximum effectiveness.

Without doing some big study I don’t think we will ever truly know. The reason I bring it up, is it comes down to effectiveness and how much time every day you are willing to give to PE. I know I am nowhere near my maximum effectiveness with hanging.

I know my current gains would have been so much more if I was hanging 28 hours a week and making sure I never took days off and kept moving up in weight as my body tells me to.

Now to the point. I can wear a device or bandage wrap that can prevent me from losing some small amount of gains but I need to wear it 20 hours out of the day and let it invade the rest of my life by constantly worrying about it. What if instead I could just do a small 10 minute stretch routine every 8 hours to prevent the same loss. This all comes down to the individual choice and that choice is being made on unsubstantiated theories. Many of us have gained without a passive stretch device being worn all day.

My personal choice is before I allow something to consume my life, why don’t I just do a better job at my current routine. Then I can always add a maintenance 10 to 20 minute set every 8 hours if I am really worried that much about losing some miniscule amount of gains.

I am truly not trying to be harsh but sometimes I see these people that are trying to throw in every additional part of PE like diet, pills, creams, injections, heat, ADS, positive thinking, and who knows what else but their routine and their consistency of maintaining their routine is lacking. I absolutely fall into this lacking category. I am not saying any of the above isn’t effective and doesn’t make a strong addition to your routine. Just don’t neglect the actual meat of your program. Maximize your actual routine first.

This is just like me and my diet/exercise. I am researching and finding new eating ideas and exercise ideas all day long. During that time I am also not doing my cardio. I guarantee some good old cardio will burn more calories then any stupid little technique I find. Even if cardio wasn’t as effective as something that I magically find on the Internet, it doesn’t change the fact that cardio is still effective and would help me reach my goals. What I do know for a fact is I am burning very little calories looking for some magic pill when the answer is already in front of me and I am just not spending my time effectively.

I enjoy your post.

I believe it is unfair and leading to individuals who may be new or not new to the subject of PE to say, “Now to the point. I can wear a device or bandage wrap that can prevent me from losing some small amount of gains but I need to wear it 20 hours out of the day and let it invade the rest of my life by constantly worrying about it.” in regards to the ADS benefits theory. We do not know at this point and will never have definitive knowledge if it prevents losing a small amount of gain or a large amount of gains or not at all. I believe this will vary person to person. Just as one person can gain quick hanging 30 hrs/week and another won’t gain quick. Also, ADS technology has advanced greatly and can now be done without invading a persons life. I used to wear an miracle slider as an ADS and it hindered certain types of movement a bit. I am massage therapist, personal trainer, and RN so I am moving around a lot. Now I have been using a Phallosan and I can wear it for an entire 12 hr shift in the hospital bending, moving, and lifting only removing to piss. Now that is just me the phallosan may not be doable for some depending on their individual circumstance.

I’ve never come across anyone myself who has tried to throw in the extras you spoke of while not being consistent. I’ve only seen people not make it to those possibly positive additions b/c they weren’t consistent. Or the people who are consistent used them beneficially. Except for positive thinking and pills (other then ED meds).I’ve never seen those work for anybody lol.

As far as bibs theory of pulling out what has been trying to heal undoing that effect WITHIN MINUTES is highly unlikely. That short a period of time would not allow our body to heal that area and once training is done if say it is just 10 minutes of hardcore hanging more trauma would just be added. Now by this I don’t mean gains won’t come. It’s just is that the quickest way to gains. We will never know and in the end as long as someone makes gains HELL YEAH!! Now if I gain an inch in 6 months or a year who cares how long it took right!!

Would you agree if someone is going for length gains and they see no positive results in 3 months time they should consider trying a different training mechanism. This is what I believe because not one thing will ever work for every person across the board. I just believe in today’s day and age of changing and quickly advancing technologies related and unrelated to PE it is a must to be fully open to many ideas being of possible positivity for some individuals and not others


LetsGrow123 is the owner of the gripping trainer website. He also posted here as ykm123321 in an effort to promote that site and the related video site. Please take any product endorsements as very likely to be biased.

Originally Posted by bhcentral
When I start healing like wolverine I will start using an anti-turtling device. I just don’t think that much healing occurs within 21 hours of my session.

Don’t get me wrong if there was an absolutely easy way to apply something or bandage things up that doesn’t require explaining if an embarrassing intimate moment happens or a bathroom moment happens I would probably use it. But I don’t want to be thinking about PE 24 hours out of the day. I don’t want the constant thinking of hoping someone doesn’t catch me with something on my penis.

I will confess I did try some bandage device earlier in my career. I could always feel it. I needed to adjust it throughout the day. I definitely had to use the bathroom stall instead of a urinal. I definitely wouldn’t want to explain it to my spouse. One time I didn’t put it on good or my being a grower caused it to fall off into my boxers. I could just imagine it falling to the ground when I picked up my kids at school.

I kept on asking myself is thing really doing anything at all.

For me it wasn’t worth it. I have definitely gained without it. I also can’t help but think that one extra hanging set will do more for me than something that produces almost no tension at all.

I hear ya. The great thing is you have made gains. I’ve made gains with ADS. Who knows if they happened quicker then without but I’ve been doing ADS since the start of consistent training for myself 5 months ago. I’ve know about PE for 7 years


LetsGrow123 is the owner of the gripping trainer website. He also posted here as ykm123321 in an effort to promote that site and the related video site. Please take any product endorsements as very likely to be biased.

One other thought I should I mention. Not everyone turtles anyways or people turtle to varying degrees. So the amount it can possibly affect their gains or speed of gains may vary. My first thought when it comes to someone who does turtle a moderate to large amount is that they could benefit more from an ADS product then someone who doesn’t turtle at all though they may be doing the same or similar routine.


LetsGrow123 is the owner of the gripping trainer website. He also posted here as ykm123321 in an effort to promote that site and the related video site. Please take any product endorsements as very likely to be biased.

Just makes sense to me that making your average size (including flaccid) is going to benefit you in making gains.

PE is a game of inches after all.


The cock thickens

Originally Posted by Longth
Just makes sense to me that making your average size (including flaccid) is going to benefit you in making gains.

PE is a game of inches after all.

Making you average size (including flaccid) what?


LetsGrow123 is the owner of the gripping trainer website. He also posted here as ykm123321 in an effort to promote that site and the related video site. Please take any product endorsements as very likely to be biased.

Larger?

It’s a logical theory. That’s all we really have in PE.


The cock thickens

Originally Posted by Longth
Larger?

It’s a logical theory. That’s all we really have in PE.

That’s what I figured.. Yes theory is all we have


LetsGrow123 is the owner of the gripping trainer website. He also posted here as ykm123321 in an effort to promote that site and the related video site. Please take any product endorsements as very likely to be biased.

LetsGrow123 thats cool. I might have to check out the phallosan when I get back into the hospital. The only ADS I ever got away with was Uncle Jim Strapped or the VLC attached below my knee. I was usually short staffed and had alot of running to do throughout the day. We have similar backgrounds with regards to career and training.

I agree that joints can’t really be compared to deforming the penis. I will be speaking in laymans terms because I’m short on time and will probably be better suited to others. Correct me if I’m wrong or feel free to add to it. I believe we are advocating for the same thing. I was just using that as an example as turtling and reduced ROM is both an inflammatory response. There are similarities (though and differences) between healing of different tissues in the body. The inflammatory process is the first response. It is a vascular and cellular response to fight off foreign agents, “clean up” devitalized tissue and start the mechanism of repair. The natural debridement from white blood cells has been shown to happen about 6 hours after injury. Assuming the inside of the penis is sterile these neutrophils will find little bacteria to “eat” and will rupture and release granulocytes. Fibroblast migrate into this new injured area and begin to synthesize and discharge into the wound monomeric collagen and mucopolysaccharides needed for synthesis of mature scar. New cells from surrounding tissues is brought to the site of injury that will soon become healthy tissue. Some of these new cells are collagen cells, see previous sentences. The body doesn’t know exactly how to organize new collagen tissue after an injury and will deposit collagen cells into clumps or balls called scar tissue after initial insult. Scar tissue in the penis sounds scary but this is patchwork and the body will come back later to remodel this scar tissue. Stretching will help this scar tissue to align so the collagen fibers can resist the tensile forces it is made to; stretching, pulling, twisting, without tearing or breaking. The take away is remodeling will further take place to make sure this new tissue becomes normal and healthy tissue again.

Because of these factors I believe using an ADS can benefit remodeling of scar tissue that will be laid down after trauma (i.e. PE) to the penis as well as help provide miniscule space between growing cells inducing hyperplasia. We apply traction devices in the same way to heal a broken bone or burn patients. I don’t believe an ADS needs to be worn for 20 hours either. Monty has made great gains and only used his weights a few hours a day or if he couldn’t get a hanging session in that day. I’m of the mindset that a balance between any goals and the life you live must be made. If ADS is too risky for you then yes focus only on your routine. I use it passively while I’m at work and then do my PE routine at home. I’m out of time but I hope I was clear.


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Last edited by longerstretch : 10-01-2014 at .

Originally Posted by LetsGrow123
Yes all of PE is pretty much unproven and anecdotal if not all of it. Even the gaining without ADS. I do believe the extender studies that have been done. Why did you say “hold” with scare quotes as if that is not what it is doing? Your ADS second category is for holding. It’s just for holding the with much less tension then something like an extender can provide. The second category ADS when using ACE wrap also does not provide much if any tension to the inner penis and ligaments. But for a person whose PE routine hits the shaft of the penis like the tunica with bundle stretching or fulcrum stretching an ADS like ACE bandage will provide some constant, even if low, tension.

When I think of the benefit of preventing turtling it comes to me as common sense. Now please don’t take that as me meaning you or anyone who doesn’t fully agree with me doesn’t have common sense. I’m not on this forum to make myself or people think I’m smarter then anyone. I enjoy these discussions and varying ideas. It is how everything in this world continues to progress and move forward. If I am proven wrong at anytime whether it be this subject or something unrelated to PE I am glad to be learning. My ego needs no checking. If the penis is allowed to turtle the cells have more closing pressure as they’re being drawn into each other more after positive trauma producing exercises which will slow down the cell generation that allows for the penis to grow. Having a constant opening pressure of the cells, even if slight, can only positively affect PE endeavors whereas I feel even though turtling will not prevent gains it can make them slower or in some people case prevent them. I believe it is possible that the people who have done PE routines consistently and become nonbelievers b/c they made no gains possibly could be related to not using an ADS and turtling.

Healing joints ROM improvement are greatly different from PE. The elasticity of even a fully functioning joint that isn’t healing due to injury or shoulder is drastically different from the elasticity of the penis to the point where stretching of skeletal muscles and joints shouldn’t be talked about and related to PE. If a muscle is stretched to increase flexibility it’s cells do not increase in number like they do with penis extender use. The same goes for joint tissue structures. Skeletal muscle and the different joint tissues in relation to stretching and flexibility can only increase in flexibility, not overall size like we are working to achieve with PE routines.

When it comes to the derogatory term “bro science”, all of PE is bro science. Now bro science should be seen as a starting off point that is making advancements to be built upon . I remember being at a expo and Arnold schwarzenegger was speaking about not being afraid to find something that no one else does or believes is true or beneficial enough to do. He used isolating upper and lower bicep muscle area with specific bicep curl variations. When he and others began doing this most of the bodybuilding world told him it was useless and it would not be or lead to being beneficial. Now everyone in the competitive bodybuilding world does it.

Ok, I will go piece by piece through things here.

I didn’t put the quotes on to be sarcastic, just because it is common language in out community and I was indicating that.

10 extender studies have been performed and have come up with very consistent results, that’s the reason I made that distinction.

I agree with you the idea seems like common sense, but just because something is common sense does not mean it’s true. Take for example building muscle mass. All along it has been common sense that when we lift we cause little tears in the muscle and they heal bigger and stronger. Most people still believe this. But modern research on muscle growth mechanisms is finding that muscular tension (load) and hormonal cascades closely tied to tension are really the key players in growth. It is not so much you mechanically directly causing muscles to grow through damage, but you providing a stimulus to adapt to that is transmitted to the muscle cells through mechanotranduction of tension and hormonal messaging. I know PE isn’t weightlifting, but the example is to show that common sense isn’t always correct, especially when we are talking about something as complex as human physiology.

When you say closing pressure, I assume you mean compressive force. It is true that compressive forces will cause tissues to shrink if applied over a great deal of time, but turtling is not a heavy compressive force, just your body’s reaction to trauma. That is, there is no external force which the fibroblasts will feel through mechanotransduction, it is the fibroblasts themselves which are causing the contracture. A brief tangent: I think it is really, really cool that fibroblasts in connective tissue can create contractile forces in those tissues even though they have no contractile protein structures like muscle cells! Ok, tangent over.

This idea of compression requires a brief description of what happens in the plastic deformation of connective tissue. Because it is not microtears as everyone always talks about. Micro tears (cavitations) do happen but it is deep in the yield region of the stress-strain curve, getting close to catastrophic failure, a place where we do not want to be. The plastic deformation we are after involves the slippage and breakage of collagen fibrils, but these do not create tears that must be filled in, broken collagen fibers are not healed they are recycled, this causes a reduction in tissue integrity, preventing the tissue from rebounding to its original size. That means that even during the contracture caused by turtling, if plastic deformation has taken place then the tissues cannot contract as far. If enough trauma had taken place, however, the tissue might form adhesions. An ADS might help prevent adhesions, but if you are hanging all fresh adhesions would probably be broken anyway in the first couple minutes the next time you hang as they are still very weak (mostly fibronectin with very little collagen deposition).

Cell proliferation: this happens, but is responsible for much less growth than is assumed. Connective tissue is actually composed of only 20% cells, the other 80% is all extracellular matrix composed of collagen, other structural proteins, proteoglycans, and water. This ECM is actually the part we need to understand and grow.

Constant positive pressure: this is, I assume, traction force you are talking about. Unless this force is great enough to cause significant displacement, no growth will occur in connective tissue. Experimentally, this has been found to be around 3% displacement to begin to stimulate fibroblasts into synthesizing collagen at a greater rate when we are talking about uniaxial stretch as in hanging, stretching or extending, and 6% displacement to begin causing plastic deformation. These numbers seem small, but they are not! A tendon stretched to 3% actually feels pretty uncomfortable. Above 6% becomes very uncomfortable, even painful as you start to exceed that strain threshold.

Comparing penile tissues to other connective tissues in the body: while this process might be imperfect, it is certainly not useless. Comparing the ligaments in the body to the suspensory ligaments is actually a very accurate comparison. And the hierarchical collagen structure of the tunica and its albuginea and its composition is almost exactly like tendon, it is so close in fact that it can actually be considered tendon in most mechanical situations.

Joints do have other aspects to their mobility. Mainly because they are often attached to muscles. Aside from the effect of skeletal muscle on joint mobility, their composition is very similar to the connective tissues in the penis. In the study I posted, the reduction in joint ROM was caused by connective tissue contracture, so regaining ROM required that this connective tissue be elongated once more, not the muscle. So in examples such as that one, the parallel is not perfect, but it is relevant.

Bro science: some aspects of PE can be linked to scientific concepts, and certainly my knowledge of connective tissue has helped me explain some of the things that happen with PE. So I don’t think it is ALL bro science.

Where did you see Arnold give his speech? That would have been amazing, he is one of my heroes.

Roots

Originally Posted by longerstretch
LetsGrow123 thats cool. I might have to check out the phallosan when I get back into the hospital. The only ADS I ever got away with was Uncle Jim Strapped or the VLC attached below my knee. I was usually short staffed and had alot of running to do throughout the day. We have similar backgrounds with regards to career and training.

I agree that joints can’t really be compared to deforming the penis. I will be speaking in laymans terms because I’m short on time and will probably be better suited to others. Correct me if I’m wrong or feel free to add to it. I believe we are advocating for the same thing. I was just using that as an example as turtling and reduced ROM is both an inflammatory response. There are similarities (though and differences) between healing of different tissues in the body. The inflammatory process is the first response. It is a vascular and cellular response to fight off foreign agents, “clean up” devitalized tissue and start the mechanism of repair. The natural debridement from white blood cells has been shown to happen about 6 hours after injury. Assuming the inside of the penis is sterile these neutrophils will find little bacteria to “eat” and will rupture and release granulocytes. Fibroblast migrate into this new injured area and begin to synthesize and discharge into the wound monomeric collagen and mucopolysaccharides needed for synthesis of mature scar. New cells from surrounding tissues is brought to the site of injury that will soon become healthy tissue. Some of these new cells are collagen cells, see previous sentences. The body doesn’t know exactly how to organize new collagen tissue after an injury and will deposit collagen cells into clumps or balls called scar tissue after initial insult. Scar tissue in the penis sounds scary but this is patchwork and the body will come back later to remodel this scar tissue. Stretching will help this scar tissue to align so the collagen fibers can resist the tensile forces it is made to; stretching, pulling, twisting, without tearing or breaking. The take away is remodeling will further take place to make sure this new tissue becomes normal and healthy tissue again.

Because of these factors I believe using an ADS can benefit remodeling of scar tissue that will be laid down after trauma (i.e. PE) to the penis as well as help provide miniscule space between growing cells inducing hyperplasia. We apply traction devices in the same way to heal a broken bone or burn patients. I don’t believe an ADS needs to be worn for 20 hours either. Monty has made great gains and only used his weights a few hours a day or if he couldn’t get a hanging session in that day. I’m of the mindset that a balance between any goals and the life you live must be made. If ADS is too risky for you then yes focus only on your routine. I use it passively while I’m at work and then do my PE routine at home. I’m out of time but I hope I was clear.

This is correct about scar tissue, it has been shown in vitro a bunch of times. If you stretch collagen (not cyclicly though) it will be remodeled by fibroblast and it’s own (really cool) innate properties in the direction of the stretch. I don’t believe we are creating a ton of scar tissue in our penile tissues when we stretch. Like virtually none if we aren’t going overboard. That would be the case if there were wounds to close, even very small ones (the process you describe is wound closure: inflammation, proliferation, etc.). This would only be the case if microtears happened, but there is no evidence of this, and is an antiquated theory. Micro failures happen during true plastic deformation, but they are not healed like a wound.

Originally Posted by LetsGrow123

I’ve never come across anyone myself who has tried to throw in the extras you spoke of while not being consistent. I’ve only seen people not make it to those possibly positive additions b/c they weren’t consistent. Or the people who are consistent used them beneficially. Except for positive thinking and pills (other then ED meds).I’ve never seen those work for anybody lol.

They are here trust me. They actually email me and ask me for advice. Yes I agree they aren’t consistent at all. But even though they aren’t consistent they are asking about heat, ads, hanging, hormones, diet and so on. I have even told them to start a routine, build on it and stop jumping from one thing to another.

Originally Posted by LetsGrow123
As far as bibs theory of pulling out what has been trying to heal undoing that effect WITHIN MINUTES is highly unlikely. That short a period of time would not allow our body to heal that area and once training is done if say it is just 10 minutes of hardcore hanging more trauma would just be added. Now by this I don’t mean gains won’t come. It’s just is that the quickest way to gains. We will never know and in the end as long as someone makes gains HELL YEAH!! Now if I gain an inch in 6 months or a year who cares how long it took right!!

Would you agree if someone is going for length gains and they see no positive results in 3 months time they should consider trying a different training mechanism. This is what I believe because not one thing will ever work for every person across the board. I just believe in today’s day and age of changing and quickly advancing technologies related and unrelated to PE it is a must to be fully open to many ideas being of possible positivity for some individuals and not others

I actually do agree with Bib’s theory. I agree because I gain with hanging. So if that same hanger and weight can grow my penis why can’t it undo any healing that might be going on to reduce gains. To me it would be far more likely that 10 to 30 pounds of weight hanging from my penis for 5 to 20 minutes can undo any healing that has happened in 20 hours more so than something that probably produces a few ounces of downwards tension even if that few ounces where in place for a year solid. Hanging is a theory but I can look at my penis and measure results. I challenge anyone with a passive ADS to chart some sort of way that they prevented loss.

I don’t know about hardcore hanging in regards to undoing what ever healing process that is shortening my penis. I am hanging my normal weight.

In regards to a 3 month time frame that would be dependent on what they are doing. If they are hanging with the normal building progression there is the chance it could take longer than three months to get to an effective weight and time to cause gains. This is completely dependent on the individual person’s physiology.

For me I started gaining at 10 pounds and a little under 10 hours a week. Some people might take a couple months getting to 10 pounds if they are too conservative. I just read a guy today who is still at 8 lbs and over 100 plus hours of hanging. If he continues on that trajectory he might not gain by the third month. The weight for him might require 17 pounds. That could take a person that goes by the book almost 4 months to get to and even longer if they are very conservative.

So I definitely wouldn’t give up at three months. Instead I would evaluate the routine again.

Just food for thought on switching to the next method. If it would have taken someone 25 lbs of weight at 10 plus hours a week to start seeing results I doubt an extender that is producing 5 or 6 pounds of force or light stretches are going to do anything for them either. I consider 25 lbs to be the exception. From what I have read Bib has only had a few people that have required that amount of weight or greater to start seeing results. However, there have been several that have taken a weight in the high teens to start seeing gains.


12/11/2013 BPEL 5 3/4 NBPEL 5 1/16 BPFSL 6 1/16 NBPFSL 5, EG Base 5 EG Mid 4 7/8 EG Below Glans 4 3/4

11/02/15 BPEL 7 1/8”, BPFSL 8 1/16”, EG Mid 5 1/4 —- Goals BPEL 7 1/2”, NBPEL 6 1/2", BPFSL 9” Motivational Resources Wanted

8/9/2014 259 lbs ---- 11/2/15 248 lbs 33.2% body fat Bhcentral's Progress Reports and Pictures

Originally Posted by LetsGrow123
One other thought I should I mention. Not everyone turtles anyways or people turtle to varying degrees. So the amount it can possibly affect their gains or speed of gains may vary. My first thought when it comes to someone who does turtle a moderate to large amount is that they could benefit more from an ADS product then someone who doesn’t turtle at all though they may be doing the same or similar routine.

I am a grower and I do turtle after almost all my routines. This does not appear to have inhibited me from gaining.

However, this is like most things on here and it is just anecdotal evidence. You should know where anecdotal evidence ranks in science.

Now I will also say because turtling bothers me aesthetically I do my jelqs right after my session and I am starting some light edging. This does appear to reduce turtling but again my example is only anecdotal.


12/11/2013 BPEL 5 3/4 NBPEL 5 1/16 BPFSL 6 1/16 NBPFSL 5, EG Base 5 EG Mid 4 7/8 EG Below Glans 4 3/4

11/02/15 BPEL 7 1/8”, BPFSL 8 1/16”, EG Mid 5 1/4 —- Goals BPEL 7 1/2”, NBPEL 6 1/2", BPFSL 9” Motivational Resources Wanted

8/9/2014 259 lbs ---- 11/2/15 248 lbs 33.2% body fat Bhcentral's Progress Reports and Pictures

Originally Posted by bhcentral
I am a grower and I do turtle after almost all my routines. This does not appear to have inhibited me from gaining.

However, this is like most things on here and it is just anecdotal evidence. You should know where anecdotal evidence ranks in science.

Now I will also say because turtling bothers me aesthetically I do my jelqs right after my session and I am starting some light edging. This does appear to reduce turtling but again my example is only anecdotal.

I turtled early on but the more I continued the less it occurred. Now it’s a thing of the past. A hearty edging session was the fix on my opinion.


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Currently: 9.75bpX6.75eg My Picture Thread

Goal:10.0bpX7.25mseg Building a thicker unit, click by click, pump by pump, jelq by jelq!

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