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Experimental new type of clamping: journal of development

Experimental new type of clamping: journal of development

Hi All,

SparkyX and I recently (a couple of weeks) ago decided to try build a workout around a new clamping method, with me as the guinea pig and him acting as the de facto advisor/theorist. We’ve been communicating on the “Intensive bends sore erection next morning” thread over on the newbie forum because up until now I didn’t have the required number of posts to be allowed to post on this board. Now that I do, I’m going to summarize or copy-paste everything over to this board, because I think many of you will find this interesting. From now on I’ll be putting my updates exclusively on this board too.

Basically, the idea is that a regular clamp has high intensity and low duration (<20 mins usually). We think this may not be long enough to achieve true plastic deformation and fatigue of the internal structure of the penis. Instead, a clamping session of 2-3 hours using only moderate force may be better. This way, one can fatigue the internal structure of the penis to the point where it starts to expand from the internal pressure, and then keep it in the expanded state for a while. So far, my experiences have been that the first hour of this type of clamping will fatigue the penis properly, and in the second and/or third hours it will expand noticeably.

To do this type of clamping, I scrapped the normal cable clamp and instead use a strip of cloth tied off around the base. This way, I get perfect, even pressure around my penis and a little bit of give from the cloth, which is important because it seems to allow more blood flow in (than a regular clamp) while keeping just enough pressure to allow little flow out. So far, I’ve only made two updates, both of which you will find below. Please read the posts below to get details on my progress and observations so far.

4/06/06
Hi Sparky,

Just wanted to give you an update. I made myself a cloth clamp from a strip of t-shirt material yesterday and did the following workout: warm-up, 20 mins or so. The warm-up consisted of some jelqs and some manual stretching.

Next, I moved onto the meat of this new workout concept. I used the cloth clamp and tied it off pretty tightly around my dick and did a standard (by standard, I mean high-intensity, short time) session. Following this session, I swelled up to about the usual measurements I get: 6.3 erect length and 5.5 erect girth.

Next, I loosened the clamp considerably and did a medium/low-intensity, medium time frame clamp session. I maintained 80%-100% engorgement (it varied). This lasted for the next 2.5 hours. Once I was done, I measured again and was very surprised. My erect length had risen to about 6.6, and my erect girth was 6 at the glans, 5.75 midshaft, and 6.5 at the base. I was astounded because I’ve never broken 6.5 in EL, but moreso I was astounded by the girth figures. I’ve never gone above 5.6 or so (6 or so at the base). In just one session, I stretched my dick out by about .5 inches in girth alone. Once I was done, I had a nice heavy flaccid hang - about 5.3 FL x 5.5 FG. This lasted for a couple of hours.

I did the math and that works about to about a 19% erect volume increase in this type of clamping session over a normal clamping session. That’s huge.

This obviously isn’t anything conclusive, but I think it shows that the plastic deformation effects of a longer, lower-intensity clamp are likely much greater than of a normal one. If I can reproduce this regularly, and I don’t see any reason why not, it should lead to greater gains provided there is enough recovery time.

4/16/06
Sparky,

Time for an update. Maybe your memory has become a bit rusty, but I’ve been doing the extended clamping session workout regularly for the last two weeks or so. I work some jelqs in afterwards and some manual stretching sometimes, but it’s hard because the clamp session takes 2 hours by itself. Sometimes I split it, 1 hour-1 hour. Either way, my next official measurement date is coming up tomorrow, so I jumped the gun by a day and measured today. The results, over the last 35 days (since March 13):
EL: 6.4 (NBP) —-> 6.6
EG:5.4 —-> 5.7
FL: 5.1 —-> 5.25
FG: 5 —-> 5.2
FSL: 6.7 —-> 6.8

Bear in mind a couple of things: 1) over this 35 days period I only spent the last 12 days on the new experimental program and 2) over the past week I didn’t get to do much PE in general because I had a ton of work. Nonetheless, EG gains are by far the most impressive. The 5.7 measurement is at the midshaft; at the glans I’m now about 6” and at the base a little over 6”. Using the formula for volume of a cone as an approximation, this works out to a 13% volume increase in 35 days or so. That’s way above my projected 9%.

So far, I’ve noticed a couple of things. 1) It really helps to get a good pump in your dick by kegeling and holding it as hard as you can while you’re fully erect and fully clamped. After a few kegels you’ll get an incredible feeling of internal pressure; you can literally feel the pressure pushing outwards on the walls of the CCs. It gives a hell of a work out. Also, when doing this, it helps to put some external pressure on the penis by using one hand to prevent it from pulling downwards (when one is fully erect and kegels, this usually pulls the penis down somewhat). For some reason this also gives a really good pump. 2) To make the extended clamping session effective, you need to do it for AT LEAST one hour. You need to wear down/tire out the internal structure of your penis sufficiently so that it starts to break down. This usually takes an hour. In the hour after that, that’s when you will really noticeably stretch yourself out in all dimensions because the internal structures are starting to buckle under the pressure a bit. I usually go for about an hour, take a 1 minute break, then go for another hour. Often I have to use pornographic material to keep myself erect that long.

Overall, my workout over the past 12 days has consisted of: 1.5-2 hour extended cloth-based clamp session maybe 5 days a week; some kegeling randomly throughout the day; 10-15 minutes of stretching 4 times a week; and about 15 minutes of jelqing 3-4 times a week. Usually I find that I have a very heavy flaccid hang, especially after the extended clamping sessions. I’d like to do more jelqing and especially stretching, but like I said, I haven’t had much free time recently, so I focused heavily on the extended clamping experiment instead.

Some observations: at this rate of growth, I’m going to hit my target girth far before my target length. I’m going to try work in more stretching exercises. I still haven’t gotten around to using golf weights yet - everything I do is manual right now. Over the next 35 days or so I should have much more free time than I had in the previous 35, so I should be able to get better workouts.

Hey Doghound,

I tried your routine tonite, 1 x 15 minute “regular” clamp set and then an hour in the clamp, a couple of clicks looser than normal. My observations are:

1) achieved my “normal” 1/2” expansion with much less pressure and no manipulation, no bends or squashes, Ulis, etc, just occasional stroking to maintain an 80-100% erection
2) no pain
3) much less, almost none…fluid buildup - I think a very good indicator
4) was able to watch TV, instead of having to concentrate on porn
5) don’t know about the post session hang, it’s good now, but I workout at night and will be going to bed soon

we’ll see what tomorrow brings in terms of my morning wood

Thanks for sharing…

fe


Goal = 5" x 5" flaccid;]


Last edited by feolds : 04-17-2006 at . Reason: more clarity

Good job,

And what about discoloration? Does your routine make discoloration bigger than regular clamping?

Very interesting! I will be watching this thread closely.


CU,

Cod

Starting: 6.25 BPEL x 4.5 EG. Upon finding Thunder's: 7 BPEL x 5 EG. 2006: 7.25 BPEL x 5.25 EG BPFS: 7.75. As of Oct. 10, 2007: 7 1/2 BPEL x 5 1/2 EG BPFS: 8 in.

Doghound,

I have not tested this but what about using your theory with a pump? Use a t-shirt type cock ring (it should can still get in a pump) and then use low pressure pumping. Then you do not have to worry about the porn or trying to stay hard.

Hey Dog and everyone,

I’ll move my posts over here that I responded with, look for the dates at the top.

04/03/06

Try hanging one or two golf wts (if you have em’) and thats all…measure 2X day with bpfl…keep track.

Take about 3 days off or until everything is normal again…totally.

Your measurements should tell you what you did…I suspect it may be productive if you take off about 2-3 days and just do light ADS.

In general, I believe if you need more than one day off to return to normal feelings and erection…decrease the force/time of your PE until one day off is enough to get back to top form ( and make small gains).

I’m am really starting to favor the approach of brief time of forces large enough to cause some stretching (JUST enough and not more) then a half or full day of minimum forces to sustain the stretch while it heals(ADS-ADC)…then possibly a day off (Xeno is working on that one, I’m checking it out myself).
__________________

04/03/06 later that day

The problem with plastic deformation-healing cycle is it rapidly ends with fibrotic changes…requiring a deconditioning cycle.

I think we should search for that “sweet spot” of force/time where we are stimulating growth,and minimizing plastic deformation. I think most of the real gainers found that magic amount.

That said, I think plastic deformation will work, provided you find the right ratio of stress to recovery to deconditioning.

Please bear in mind that bends do generate a lot of internal pressure so always make sure you are totally recovered before you repeat it…that means great nite and am wood with NO residual soreness.
———————————————

04/04/06

Dog,

Thats very respectable gains…however it maybe possible that it is the easy newbie gains…the real test is sustainability.

I think you are doing some right things here…if you were WAY off track, you wouldn’t get getting any gains at all.

I feel that if any PE takes more than a day off to completely recover, its too much. I have nothing to back that up at all, and it may turn out to be wrong…hell it may turn out that 2-3 days is best, but for now I advise no more than 2 days of time off for complete recovery.

It may turn out that daily mild pe with an occasional deconditioning break when gains slow (as opposed to increasing time/force is best…I’m leaning in that direction) is best.

I think empiric evidence is piling up that maintaining the stretch in the direction of the higher force strain, for a period of time, is most conducive to growth.

That basically means, for example if you hang, after you finish use a small amount of pe wt, like one of Monty’s rings, for a period of time (yet to be exactly determined) to maintain the expansion without inducing any further damage…while it sets or heals in place.

For those that are working girth, use some soft constriction device that doesn’t cause discoloration.

I personally have been experimenting with using both at the same time for both length and girth, following a vacuum hanging routine. (Monty has had great sustained gains with this approach, and uses very modest wts in his hanging routines, I give him the most credit in this area).

Xeno has been doing some great work in this area, take a look at it, although right now it is a highly technical discussion that may be intimidating.

Xeno is working on a thread where he will present it in a more user friendly form (I’m hoping anyway).

So, for you Dog…I believe bends are primarily a girth expander…I don’t know if that is what you are shooting for.

So, lets say you want both…I would say taper your routine so that you are FULLY recovered after one day. This will be our starting point.

Xeno refers to a micro cycle of PE in the morning, ADS AND ADC (use both if you can) for the remainder of the day, then remove the ADS and ADC for the night and the whole next day.

Then you would repeat the cycle. So its like a one on, one off. But it is specifically manipulation of different aspects of the day on and off.

I think for you, this is a very good place to start.

Do this for several weeks and measure your gains.

After a few weeks, I would recommend slightly changing the routine, so on your off day, you MAINTAIN your ADS and ADC for the whole “off” day.

Do that for few weeks and see which one gave you best gains.

Get back to me with your results…because I think THIS is really an important question to answer.

If I don’t answer within a day, PM me…I have so many threads I’m commenting on…I lose track!
————————————————————————————————

04/04/06 later that day
To link, just highlight the address, right click and click on copy, then paste it on the reply box. I’m sure that was clear as mud.

Sounds great, I’m really interested in your results.

Remember to monitor the PIs, especially nite and morning wood.

Measure daily.

Just to make sure you understand, pe in the morning and the rest of the day ADS and or ADC then remove it when you go to sleep, next day total rest…nothing at all.

Then repeat the micro-cycle.

Keep me posted!
———————————————————————————————

04/06/06

A couple comments;

First of all…sounds good.

I think the cable clamp may be better for the high intensity session…try and see,then use the cloth for maintaining 50% or more as long as you can.

Make sure you maintain good circulation, that will be evident by having normal coloration and temp.

I think if you can keep at least partial erection the remainder of the day is best.

At nite take off any constrictor.

Now, you can either take the next day off completely or repeat the cycle. [so a one on, one off or a daily micro-micro cycle.]

As I have said, try a few weeks of each and see which one produces better results.

Now, as far as golf wts go…I think ADS actually works against girth gains…IF the wt is so heavy that it pulls you out to the extent you lose girth from the ADC.

I find one pe weight is enough to keep my length gains, but not so much that my inflation gets “deflated”.

Two pe wts will overcome my ADC and make me hang long and thin.

The next critical factor is what happens the next two or three days.

If you get great wood that nite, and the next day a long and heavy flaccid…I think you may be able to pull off a daily, micro-micro cycle.

Ultimately, I think that if you can recover in time for a daily micro-micro cycle, you will get the best gains…but that’s just my gut feeling, I have no real info to back that up.

With that heavy of a PE routine…I find it hard to believe you won’t benefit from at least one day off.

Me, even with modest pe forces, I need a day off. The only question for me is to whether I should do even lighter ADC/ADS on my off day…or take it totally off from everything.

I’m trying to determine that now.

You have good girth, I might mention that if you are trying to get length, I really feel girth builders work against length gains…in general.

Some gain both equally with bends and clamping, but most get mostly girth.

If you want length, I recommend focussing on that for now with hanging, then go for girth when you get near the length you want.

I think its pretty obvious you will be able to gain girth fairly easily when you are at your desired length.

Get back with what happens the next day, and that nite of your PE routine (looking for nite and morning wood).
__________________

04/16/06
Hey dog!

Great gains! I have 2 concerns…1) Really high pressures for prolonged periods…I hope to God you don’t blow something out!

2) Significant tissue toughening might make length gains extremely difficult!

I just wrote a thread discussing this topic;

Understanding force thresholds for growth

take a read then PM me if you have any questions.

Originally Posted by doghound

Basically, the idea is that a regular clamp has high intensity and low duration (<20 mins usually). We think this may not be long enough to achieve true plastic deformation and fatigue of the internal structure of the penis. Instead, a clamping session of 2-3 hours using only moderate force may be better. This way, one can fatigue the internal structure of the penis to the point where it starts to expand from the internal pressure, and then keep it in the expanded state for a while. So far, my experiences have been that the first hour of this type of clamping will fatigue the penis properly, and in the second and/or third hours it will expand noticeably.

To do this type of clamping, I scrapped the normal cable clamp and instead use a strip of cloth tied off around the base. This way, I get perfect, even pressure around my penis and a little bit of give from the cloth, which is important because it seems to allow more blood flow in (than a regular clamp) while keeping just enough pressure to allow little flow out. So far, I’ve only made two updates, both of which you will find below. Please read the posts below to get details on my progress and observations so far.

Dog,

After re-reading this, I have to admit that if forgot we discussed the part of moderate force clamping (brain is getting old) and that puts it in a totally better category.

The forces are lower, it is much less likely to cause severe toughening, it should be much less likely to cause darkening and other injuries.

I think it is important to keep the clamp (soft) set at a level where you maintain normal or near normal coloration.

This indicates proper tissue oxygenation…which is obviously good, because there are indicators that decreased oxygen levels leads to fibrosis, not to mention necrosis (tissue death).

So the other factor as I mentioned in my last post was toughening.

I think that you will get much less toughening from moderate clamping than full pressure…turn your dick purple clamping…however…is it enough less?

We can’t really answer that right now, that’s why you must daily measure and watch you PI’s.

It may very well be that you maintain good erectile quality, but toughen your tunica to the point that length gains stop completely.

Read my new thread that I posted above, I go into this concept.

If it turns out that it stops length gains, and you WANT more length, than the answer is to put this on hold, get the length you want…then return to this for girth.

I am one of those that believe if you toughen your tunica from heavy girth work…that it will make length gains very difficult for most guys.

Of course there is always deconditioning…but that may be up to 3 months for those who have really toughened the tissues.

Originally Posted by disi
Good job,

And what about discoloration? Does your routine make discoloration bigger than regular clamping?

Wrapping for girth worsened my discoloration, though not as much as higher intensity clamping. It may not have the same effect for everyone. For example, Bib said wrapping removed some of his.

Wrapping to remove discoloration
Synergistic effect of wrapping on hanging and uli’s for Bib, etals

Low intensity wrapping is on the lower end of the discoloration-inducing PE techniques spectrum. Keep in mind that a wrap can be applied at varying levels of constriction, and it can be difficult to get set just right for longer term engorgement. If too tight you’ll completely shut off blood outflow as the engorgement builds, which is the same as clamping.

Though other things can also result in discoloration, one sure-fire recipe for me is pressure under tightly stretched skin. Avoid that situation if you are prone to discoloration.

Hi All,

To answer all the questions that have been posed so far:

1) I don’t get any discoloration at all. Usually I have some small red spots from burst blood vessels, but it goes away within 24 hours. During the clamp session, I’m pretty discolored - my dick goes a deep dark purple, but I figure it’s all good because my dick stays warm and I don’t go numb, which means I’m not cutting off blood flow to the point that it’s unhealthy.

2) I don’t have a pump, never used one, I guess it could work similarly to using a pump, but right now I’m focusing on clamping because I want to see what results it brings.

Feolds: I used my regular cable clamp at first when I was feeling my way around with this experiment, but I want to emphasize again that using a strip of cloth is FAR better than a plastic clamp. The cloth just gives you a much more even pressure on all of the veins around the base of your penis because it shapes itself to the contours of your penis. It also stretches a bit, which is important because as your clamping session progresses, it allows your dick to stretch out beyond its normal limits. Also, you wrote that you clamped for one hour. I suggest you try going for 2-3 hours with a cloth clamp, with a 1 minute break every 45 minutes, and see what happens.

I’m ordering golf weights online, I can’t find them in any of the golf shops around here.

Originally Posted by doghound
1) I don’t get any discoloration at all. Usually I have some small red spots from burst blood vessels, but it goes away within 24 hours. During the clamp session, I’m pretty discolored - my dick goes a deep dark purple, but I figure it’s all good because my dick stays warm and I don’t go numb, which means I’m not cutting off blood flow to the point that it’s unhealthy.

I have to disagree.. purple, to my knowledge indicates very little oxygen left in the blood.

That’s why with full pressure clamping, the guideline is generally 10 mins…I think some go 15 minutes….I certainly don’t recommend longer sets than that.

The other thing…as I’ve mentioned, I seem to remember low oxygen levels contribute to fibrosis.

That’s the other reason for long duration partial clamping, I recommend maintaining normal or near normal coloration.

Originally Posted by doghound
I’m ordering golf weights online, I can’t find them in any of the golf shops around here.

Forget the golf wts and order Monty530’s PE weights…they are the best hands down!

I just might mention, that PE wts work best for length…as ADS after hanging.

I believe they tend to work AGAINST girth gains if you are shooting for ADC.

I use one when I want girth gains…because I can use one with my ADC and it doesn’t cause my flaccid to get stretched out to the point girth is gone.

More than that causes me to hang long and thin.

Two or more I use only when going for length as in ADS.

Hey doghound,

I’m just wondering exactly how tight you tie the cloth. I kind of want to try this as well, but I’m not sure how tight I should be tying the thing.

Also, are you staying as erect as possible while tied off? You basically tie off, get as erect as possible, and then keep this erection for the entire 1 hour? The fact that you say that you still feel this immense presure seems to say that you’re still clamped off pretty tightly, but I guess that’s not the case?

You’re tying off and getting huge pressure but as the same time blood is allowed to flow in and out as opposed to a regular clamping session where it is not… is this the idea?

Could you give a few more details on clamping tightness and erection strength as well as what I mentioned above? I would love to try this out, maybe tonight if possible.

Thanks and good job with the new technique!

Mick

Doghound,

I replied but it seemed to have dissappeared. I do wrap w/sweatshirt material, then a self adhering ace type bandage, the clamp was loosely applied to hold it all in place.

I did not have great wood this a.m. so I’m taking the day off, no weights, adc or anything.

I will try the 2 x 45 routine tomorrow. It appears that based on those studies, a minimum of 15 hrs erect time per week is needed to get results. You agree? That would mean consecutive work days. Any thoughts?

BTW - as far as discoloration, my unit was much less darker yesterday versus my normal heavily clamped coloration.


Goal = 5" x 5" flaccid;]

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