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Jelqing is killing me!

Originally Posted by RoomToGrow
Oh I see how it is, Zigga. Take the adivce when it comes from a mod. Thanks! *sulking* <kicking dirt while walking away pouting> :frown2:

Sorry I didn’t aknowledge your advice; I do appreciate it! ;)

Quote
I wore out my rotator cuff from using bad posture when sitting and managed to bugger it when hitting a tennis ball overhead. It’s finally better but my shoulders still feel uncomfortable doing overhand jelqs. If your shoulders are clicking and you have a ‘strange pain’, it’s probably a ligament injury rather than a case of muscle weakness. It won’t get better by lifting weights at the gym, in fact that is likely to make it worse for now, instead you will have to rest. I just use an underhand grip for jelqs instead, can do hundreds like that without getting tired. Be sure to squeeze the sides of your wang and avoid excess pressure on the top.

I’m not sure exactly what a rotator cuff is, but I’m assuming you mean the socket that your arm rotates in at your shoulder. This does sound spot on; but I just don’t get as good a workout from an underhand jelq :(

Zig,

I am sure you have already done this, but the posturing of your upper body and the full body motion as you jelq might make a difference.
I am a newbie (only jelqed for 8 months) but on different occasions have, instead of concentrating on the jelq, concentrated on the whole body motion and have found different methods that can either work or relax varied areas of the body. (Personally my problem area is my hands cramping from the grip if I am not staying aware). In allowing the upper body to move (rock and pivot) more a style of jelqing can be obtained that does not utilize rotation in the shoulder as much.

So, if you haven’t already, you might try going back to the drawing board on the overall movement.

What ever the solution, I hope you find it.

Originally Posted by Laeh
Zig,

I am sure you have already done this, but the posturing of your upper body and the full body motion as you jelq might make a difference.
I am a newbie (only jelqed for 8 months) but on different occasions have, instead of concentrating on the jelq, concentrated on the whole body motion and have found different methods that can either work or relax varied areas of the body. (Personally my problem area is my hands cramping from the grip if I am not staying aware). In allowing the upper body to move (rock and pivot) more a style of jelqing can be obtained that does not utilize rotation in the shoulder as much.

So, if you haven’t already, you might try going back to the drawing board on the overall movement.

What ever the solution, I hope you find it.

Thanks a lot man; that’s really interesting. I think I have intuitively started moving my whole back into the jelqing movement to relieve pressure on the arms and shoulders. It doesn’t help enough though.

Cramping in the hands, especially the meaty part in between the thumb and forefinger, is a bitch too. I don’t see how the involvement of upper body movement would help to alleviate this though. Does it, for you?


Last edited by ziggaman : 03-08-2005 at .

Originally Posted by ziggaman
Sorry I didn’t aknowledge your advice; I do appreciate it! ;)


Na, zigga, it’s all good. Just messin’. Just in one of those moods today :p .


-rtg

Have your wife or girlfriend do it, I’m sure she wouldn’t mind

It makes sense to change your jelqing form. But if the problem is muscular then the right rehab program could help it. Yeah you probably wouldn’t want to go into a physical therapist’s office and demonstrate the act that causes the pain though :)

Try researching the rotator cuff as someone mentioned. It’s basically a group of four small muscles in your shoulder that help stablize and move the arm about the socket. http://www.bodyresults.com/E2RotatorCuff.asp

Specifically the external rotator muscles I have heard that many martial artists tend to wear on this area especially if they punch in the air a lot (nothing to absorb the force except the external rotator muscles).

Try some rotator cuff exercises with maybe a pound (or less) of weight, high reps (12-15) and see if you notice any difference. The lying L-fly is a good place to start.
here is another link with different pictures.
http://www.weightliftingdiscussion.com/lflye.html

Also stretch the chest, many people have shortened internal rotators that can cause overstretch/weakening of the external rotators. Also stretch the external rotators.

I -think- that clicking can mean that the joint is not tracking 100% correctly and something is rubbing where it shouldn’t. I guess that could mean worn cartilage, or ligament damage. However, it seems to me that worn/weak/injured muscles not functioning correctly could also cause a joint to track poorly, and cause the clicking. The shoulder socket is a pretty shallow one, which gives it great mobility but consequently poorer inherent stability. so it takes quit a bit of work on the part of the muscles to make sure it stays where it’s supposed to be.

all this is my cribbing from “The 7-minute Rotator Cuff solution”, which I picked up because I have some shoulder problems of my own, and it has helped quite a bit. It might be out of print now, and while it’s a handy book there are other sources of info out there.

Hope this was relevant.


I don't know if I believe anything of what I just wrote but will pretend to for the sake of discussion.

Wow, thank you for that detailed analysis.

It makes a lot of sense: The combination of jelqing and the martial arts I do, is probably pulling the ‘tracking’, as you put it, all out of whack.

How annoying; it sounds like I really should give jelqing a rest. I don’t think it would be anywhere near as bad, if I was just doing martial arts.

Originally Posted by supasonic
…Specifically the external rotator muscles I have heard that many martial artists tend to wear on this area especially if they punch in the air a lot (nothing to absorb the force except the external rotator muscles)…

Zigga, you need to attach a theraband from your wrist to your Captain’s wench when you do your punches in the air. That’ll allow you to cut back your stretching time and save your rotator cuffs for jelquing.

On a more serious note, I have some trouble with my right shoulder myself, as a result from a skiing accident nearly 20 year ago. Strengthening the muscles that keep the shoulderblades in place by use of rowing machine, pulling weights from above behind neck (wide grip bar), pulling weights with straight arms from above and down past my navel (wide grip bar) and doing pushups on a large pilates ball was part of the starters to get the main muscle package in shape, and then I was set to work more specifically on the rotators et al. Low weights, GOOD FORM, EXACT MOVEMENTS and quitting as soon as I started to get to tired to keep the good form was repeatedly mentioned by my physical therapist.

Also, I shifted the mouse to my left hand when working with the computer.

regards,


Last edited by mgus : 03-09-2005 at .

Originally Posted by mgus
Zigga, you need to attach a theraband from your wrist to your Captain’s wench when you do your punches in the air. That’ll allow you to cut back your stretching time and save your rotator cuffs for jelquing.

On a more serious note, I have some trouble with my right shoulder myself, as a result from a skiing accident nearly 20 year ago. Strengthening the muscles that keep the shoulderblades in place by use of rowing machine, pulling weights from above behind neck (wide grip bar), pulling weights with straight arms from above and down past my navel (wide grip bar) and doing pushups on a large pilates ball was part of the starters to get the main muscle package in shape, and then I was set to work more specifically on the rotators et al. Low weights, GOOD FORM, EXACT MOVEMENTS and quitting as soon as I started to get to tired to keep the good form was repeatedly mentioned by my physical therapist.

Also, I shifted the mouse to my left hand when working with the computer.

regards,

Lol. Thanks mgus. I’ll start off with just the press ups. I can already do quite a lot, but I tend to do them on my knuckles, which works the back muscles more. I’ll start doing them on flat hands, to work the front muscles.

No, the upper body movement does not directly help the hand cramping. The bigger help is the mental state - making sure that none of my body is tensing up during the routine. Often I find that when working/exercising one muscle group other muscles/areas tense up. Being aware of this and consciously keeping the un-needed areas relaxed is the most successful general method for me in not getting the hand cramps.

I’m learning valuable stuff here: the finer points of jelqing technique! :up:

Zigga,

If you lean against a wall, say 45-60 degrees, as if you were to make a pushup, does the shoulder blade on your bad side “wing” out? There’s a neat term for this, vingscapula (presumed translation: wingscapula) You want to have someone look at you doing this, preferably a little bit into your workout so that you are a bit fatigued. If you wing out - the part of you shoulder blade that is closest to your spine starts lifting = isn’t kept flat along the back - a number of muscles could be failing you, but one is likely to be the romboideus, the diamond shaped one that pulls the tips of the shoulder blades in towards the back. This is worked on via the pulling motions I mentioned above (low load, good form, exact movement). Also, you’ll probably have a sore Serratus Anterior (is it sore where it passes over your ribs right under your armpit?). If you have wingscapula, the weakened shoulder blade muscles allow more pressure to be placed on the shoulder joint muscles, which in turn starts hurting them etc.

Just plain pushups ain’t gonna do it for you. You see, I could do pushups as well, but that wasnt helping me. The larger muscles would take over what the smaller - the ones keeping things in place - couldn’t quite do. That’s why my P.T. kept nagging about good form and exact movements. Also, LOW LOAD so that you can concentrate on keeping your small muscles in good form and feel it once they start slipping. The idea of making pushups on a pilates ball is that the damn thing moves - you need to use the smaller muscles (the ones that keep things in place) to keep your good form while at the same time compensating for the moving ball.

Another really silly workout (you want to do this in private first) is to stand on all fours and push your back up just like a cat arches it’s back, but concentrate on lifting your shoulder blades the highest - the romboideus would be at the highest point of your back. Allow your head to fall down and focus on the area between your shoulder blades. Imagine putting a tape measure on the outside of one hand, over your back and down to the other hand - you want this distance to be maximized. Hold a few seconds, focus on lifting max. Do this 10 times and you should feel nasty little stinging sensations behind your shoulders.

Wingscapula or not, you want the muscles that keep the shoulder blades in position in good shape - then your rotator cuffs etc should be able to work with a minimum of unneccessary disturbance. By the way, very few physical therapists are good at shoulders - it is a very complex subject. There is apparently in-depth education for shoulders, find one with a diploma from them.

regards,

Originally Posted by mgus
Another really silly workout (you want to do this in private first) is to stand on all fours and push your back up just like a cat arches it’s back, but concentrate on lifting your shoulder blades the highest - the romboideus would be at the highest point of your back. Allow your head to fall down and focus on the area between your shoulder blades.

Bruce Lee used to do this as a warm up in some of his pictures. I’m referring specifically to ‘Way of the Dragon’, just before he’s about to fight Chuck Norris in the Coloseum.

His shoulder blades stuck right out!

I can now be more specific about the location of the achy clicking pain I am experiencing: It’s at the front of my shoulder. On top, where the muscle meets the collar-bone.

I’m gonna hit the gym soon. Hopefully strengthening all the muscles will help. If not, I’m fucked, because I’m not giving up jelqing! :noreally:

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