Apologies that it’s taken so long for me to post but it’s taken me time to read all of the above threads.
Totaly unrelated question, how do I change font and colour, and put links to other pages in my posts. Someone PM me don’t wanna hijack.
Just under the ‘Submit Reply’ button (under the text field) there’s a “Posting Rules” box. Check out the links in that box for instructions on formatting etc.
Originally Posted by Mad HatterMr. Fantastic:If you don’t mind the off-topic question, how long have you been doing 500 minute long hanging sessions? All year since you started? Or did you just recently move up to that?
I don’t record total time spent hanging (maybe you have me confused with another member),
MH— my apologies— I didn’t realise you’d got the ‘500 minute’ figure from my personal profile. The truth of the matter is that provided you have a light enough weight you can hang from dusk ‘till dawn. The trick is to find a weight that’s right for you for the time available (and that’s best done through trial and error)
If it’s the CC’s that are pushing the limits of the tunica’s elasticity, then elongating the tunica would theoretically give you the quick gains while doing more CC exercises at this stage would probably only serve for circumference/girth work. Continued CC exercise at this point may bulk so much spongy material around the tunica that it becomes progressively harder and harder to isolate the tunica inside of all the sponge for length work. This would help to explain why way too much girth labor over tunica work ultimately inhibits length gains.
The CCs are contained within the tunica. With clamping, the tunica is forced to expand by the expanding CCs but the CCs are always contained within the Tunica. In terms of restriction of growth it’s the collagen that seems to be the real problem.
In martial arts this same scenario happens frequently, where the student in question has been in the gym bulking up muscle mass but has largely ignored their stretches and dexterity work. Essentially, they’re at a loss in matches because their muscles have bulked around their ligaments so much they can’t stretch as effectively as their opponent and they’re now stuck being marginalized as having to rely on up-close brute force alone. Speed, reach ability, dexterity, all of which rely on elasticity, are irrevocably their weak points until they lose the excessive muscle mass.
The ways in which (and for what purpose) the tissues of the body combine, differ in the different structures of the body. Therefore there’s a limit to the extent to which the technical knowledge of body-building and other physical disciplines is applicable to PE, basically because they deal with different structures which themselves differ in function/purpose. e.g. the penis doesn’t have muscles— you can’t curl weights with it to build it, but it does have a tunica as do all of the muscles of the body…
…you have to stretch the tunicas surrounding the muscles to allow the muscles they contain to grow at the rate they can be built through pumping iron, but with PE we’re approaching the problem from the other end, i.e. were attacking the tunica which exercises the CCs at the same time (at least that’s how I see it)
We can blast through the tunica with clamping but that’s such an intense exercise that it creates the wrong type of collagen— just what we don't want for length gains (more below)
When it comes to PE and other physical disciplines, most of the cross-compatible data deals with the common tissues and, for example, how they react to strain & respond to nutrition.
Back on topic, when you consider that the tunica and the CC chambers are made of different materials it follows that they will have different levels of toughness; each would have a different exercise need to fulfill. And considering different PE exercises put more or less emphasis on one or the other at a time, I suppose that’s how I got the “potato sack race” idea in my head. It could be that hanging down low puts proportionally more stress on the CC’s than the tunica, and hanging inverted V stretches puts proportionally more stress on the tunica than the CC’s. But who knows really.
…the elasticity of the tunica is the limiting factor of how much the CC chambers can expand when erect. The more tunica, the more space for the CC chambers to fill, assuming the CC chambers are capable of expanding enough (have been exercised enough) to fill around the tunica to the maximum capacity.
When you think about it, if the tunica is capable of flexing more distance than the CC chambers are capable of filling while erect (from extensive tunica stretching), then you’re already missing some erect length and girth potential and working on Uli’s and jelqs would logically be the right path to take to even the gains.
It seems to me that since the tunica is to tough, anything that’s going to cause micro-tears to the tunica should, presumably, rip the shit out out of the CC’s— so is simultaneous girth-work really necessary? Surely the CCs are going to be worked along with the tunica. ModestoMan touches on this in the Why Gains Slow thread and - depending on your point of view - either seems to answer his own question or questions his own answer:
Some hangers have noted that, as they grow, gains in their BPEL often lag behind gains in FBPSEL. I’ve often wondered whether this delay is caused by the internal structures needing to “catch up” with the tunica’s growth.
He also states:
At some point, the internal tissues probably do have to grow. I agree with Shiver that they probably grow along with the tunica, and are stretched at the same time.
I recently saw a drawing of the inside layer of the tunica, as it blended into the tissues within a CC. It was not an abrupt transition, as a simple membrane would be. Instead, the tunica actually had projections extending radially into to body of the CC to form a network of small pockets (I think they’re called “trabeculae”). The walls of the pockets are made of the same stuff as the inside layer of the tunica, and are coextensive with it.
This means that stretching the tunica really does stretch some of the internal structure of the CCs, as they really are structurally integrated with one another.
Even if the tunica were to “get ahead” of the internal structures of the CCs, normal erections would probably (guessing) provide enough pressure to induce the structures to fill the available space. I don’t believe that anything inside the CCs provides anywhere near the resistance to expansion that the tunica itself provides.
I personally think that anything that’s going to cause micro-tears in the tunica is definitely going to affect the CCs because the CCs and tunica are inter-meshed.
As for girth-work to fill out the gaps— it might be worthwhile to do a little girth-work after length-work just to plump things up in an effort to keep the micro-tears wide, in the same way that one should use an ADS to keep everything healing in a lengthened state. But I don’t think that clamping is the way to go. If anything, jelqing is the way forward.
The Why Gains Slow thread details two studies that mirror the clamping technique and while they both state that clamping will create growth the most detailed and closest to what we do in PE states that what’s created is the tough type of collagen that we don’t want. In other words— clamping will toughen or ‘condition’ the penis in a way that can inhibit length-gains.
That’s why it’s best to get the length you want before you begin intensive girth work…continued clamping toughens the penis but is intense enough to keep breaking through those toughened fibres.
If you want to work on girth at the same time as length Jelq, don’t clamp. Jelqing - if done in a particular way - will also help length and it’s also been suggested that it ‘confuses’ the collagen to make gains that don’t toughen the tissues as much.
Personally I’m not going to be doing any girth-work until I’ve got the length I want.
Previously known as Mr. Fantastic
Last edited by Mr. Fantastic : 01-22-2006 at .