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Why Bib's LOT Theory holds water

marinera,
>You can’t pull out the inner penis.<

Do you think that it would be more constructive if you prefaced your input with, “In my opinion” or said, “based on yadda yadda…”.

Because I believe that I have pulled out my inner penis and it seems like djrobins believes it is possible. I did not have hair on my shaft when I was in my twenties. Now I have over an inch and I am still getting more. Please explain that phenomena.

Guys who have a shaft that is held tight up against their Pubic Bone such that it points at 11:00 when erect can lower that to 9:00 and in the process gain maybe an inch of outer shaft length.

If that length was not inside the body before then where did it come from?

>That’s why LOT theory doesn’t makes sense either.<
The above is EXACTLY why the LOT Theory makes sense.

Where do you believe your gains came from Marinera?

What part of the theory does not make sense to you?

sheLovesIt

Originally Posted by cantlook
Are we completely over thinking this stuff?

Probably, but we need to do something while we are working hard to make gains. I just want to be as efficient as possible. That is one of the things that the Theory can do. It also can help explain why some guys do not get gains or stop gaining.

Originally Posted by cantlook
Sure, pulling in one direction or the other will target different ligaments, but when we are erect and “using” our penis it is usually around the 9:00 range. (Yes it will vary, but for the sake of argument I’m using 9) So for me, my “length” is determined by the position and flexibility while in the 9:00 position because that’s the position I’m in when I measure and the position I’m in 95% of the time when I’m using my penis.

Shouldn’t we be targeting whatever is limiting us in the direction that we use the most?


BTW when you had 6 in there I was trying to imagine how that would work. Kind of like riding a poggo-stick.

At first blush ths makes sense. However this suggests you have not fully understood the divide and conquer concept or you do not believe that it is possible.

If you have a high LOT then stretch the ligs with lower angles until no more gains. Your LOT should lower as an indicator along with a few other things. NOTE: You may stop gaining at this point so you need to then stretch the tunica using upper angle stretch. NOTE: When using the upper angles the ligs will not be involved. This is divide and conquer.

Does this make sense to you?

sheLovesIt


Last edited by sheLovesIt : 03-09-2012 at .

Originally Posted by sheLovesIt
Probably, but we need to do something while we are working hard to make gains. I just want to be as efficient as possible. That is one of the things that the Theory can do. It also can help explain why some guys do not get gains or stop gaining.

BTW when you had 6 in there I was trying to imagine how that would work. Kind of like riding a poggo-stick.

At first blush ths makes sense. However this suggests you have not fully understood the divide and conquer concept or you do not believe that it is possible.

If you have a high LOT then stretch the ligs with lower angles until no more gains. Your LOT should lower as an indicator along with a few other things. NOTE: You may stop gaining at this point so you need to then stretch the tunica using upper angle stretch. NOTE: When using the upper angles the ligs will not be involved. This is divide and conquer.

Does this make sense to you?

sheLovesIt


I too had quite a laugh when I noticed the 6:00 mistake. ;)

Honestly, I do not buy into “divide and conquer” as you are describing it.

Much like you referred to my understanding, this flashy LOT theory also sounds good at first, but for the life of me I can not make the connection between the theory and actual mechanics of a growing penis. Also, I can not find an image that supports the idea that pulling in one direction is of any advantage compared to another as far as effectively stressing the ligaments that are limiting growth. I simply don’t see how pulling down “divides” anything. Perhaps I am missing something obvious (or subtle) that you can describe for me?

The tug back theory seems to me like the analysis of two or more muscle/ligament systems and how they relate to each other, but does not seem to give me any insight into how to make quicker gains.

That is my understanding as of now. Tomorrow is a new day.


Keep an open mind and a closed wallet... unless it\'s open to making a donation!

cantlook,

>I can not find an image that supports the idea that pulling in one direction is of any advantage compared to another as far as effectively stressing the ligaments that are limiting growth. I simply don’t see how pulling down “divides” anything. Perhaps I am missing something obvious (or subtle) that you can describe for me?<

This is an image of what gets cut in enlargement surgery, that is the suspensory ligament. Note how once that lig is cut it will allow the part of the shaft which is held tight to the pubic bone to drop more.

Imagine that the erection now can be more straight instead of following up the pubic bone before it exits the body. Straighter is longer. The exit point would move down.

This is your 6:00 erection! Just kidding. The shape of the tunica takes over and has the effect of holding you in a SO position.

Instead of cutting those ligs you can just stretch them. Look at the picture and decide for yourself what direction would be most effective for stretching the ligaments.

If you chose SD to BTC then you are fairly intuitive. That step was a “divide” in the sense that at the SD and BTC angle you have directed the stretch to the ligaments vs the tunica anchors.

To involve the tunica anchors is a mistake. How many men would you want to play tug-of-war against, one or two?

After you stretch the ligs then you can stretch at the upper angles, SO and OTS, so that the lengthened ligs do not engage and the majority of the stress is on the tunica anchors.

sheLovesIt

Attached Images

Originally Posted by sheLovesIt
cantlook,

>I can not find an image that supports the idea that pulling in one direction is of any advantage compared to another as far as effectively stressing the ligaments that are limiting growth. I simply don’t see how pulling down “divides” anything. Perhaps I am missing something obvious (or subtle) that you can describe for me?<

This is an image of what gets cut in enlargement surgery, that is the suspensory ligament. Note how once that lig is cut it will allow the part of the shaft which is held tight to the pubic bone to drop more.

Imagine that the erection now can be more straight instead of following up the pubic bone before it exits the body. Straighter is longer. The exit point would move down.

This is your 6:00 erection! Just kidding. The shape of the tunica takes over and has the effect of holding you in a SO position.

Instead of cutting those ligs you can just stretch them. Look at the picture and decide for yourself what direction would be most effective for stretching the ligaments.

If you chose SD to BTC then you are fairly intuitive. That step was a “divide” in the sense that at the SD and BTC angle you have directed the stretch to the ligaments vs the tunica anchors.

To involve the tunica anchors is a mistake. How many men would you want to play tug-of-war against, one or two?

After you stretch the ligs then you can stretch at the upper angles, SO and OTS, so that the lengthened ligs do not engage and the majority of the stress is on the tunica anchors.

sheLovesIt


I don’t doubt that once lengthened (or in this image, cut) the penis will stretch further. What I still don’t see from this image is how pulling downward lengthens more than pulling outward (or up).

Obviously the lines representing the ligaments on this drawing show the ligaments pointing downward, which would bias towards the idea of pulling downward, but they are not static are they? They attach at a static point on the pubic bone and a static point in the penis, but if the penis is pulled up, will they not swing and stretch upward with it? How does pulling straight out cause any less stress than straight down?

I am not trying to be stubborn, or stupid, but I really don’t see it.


Keep an open mind and a closed wallet... unless it\'s open to making a donation!

cantlook,

IMO in real life, some guys have short, repeat short, ligs. In this picture they show the ligs long so that you can see what they are talking about.

Keep in mind there are guys, and I have seen pictures, where the erection points at 11:00. The shaft is tight against the PB. The LOT Theory benefits these guys the most. You may have longer ligs and in that case the LOT Theory may tell you not to waste time at the lower angles and to move to tunica stretch at the higher angles. I’ll warn you, most guys need some BTC work before doing tunica work. If you stretch SO and have ligs engaged then you are working against more than you have too.

Not sure what you mean by static. They stretch very little before becoming taut. Less than 5%. If you mean the direction of the fibers is down then yes, the ligaments are fibers and have an axis when stretched. Please do some research on ligament images. I assume that most guys do some independent research. Maybe I am wrong.

Study it more. I am not pedaling anything here.

I look at my package and it has changed noticeably in the last 6 months doing BTC hanging.

When I palpate my inner penis it is significantly less. Bigger had it right.

I am going to stop preaching soon. I will leave it to the really studious to pick through it.

nuff said for one day. Good night.

sheLovesIt

Originally Posted by sheLovesIt
Study it more. I am not pedaling anything here.


If that’s a shot at my having a “Commercial Account” I am not pedaling anything here either. There was a time when I toyed with the idea of assembling a homemade extended for those who didn’t want to build their own, but it didn’t work out with my current situation. I haven’t sold anything or received a penny from anyone, and probably never will, yet my eagerness and honesty at the time leaves me forever cursed with the commercial label.

I am here to learn and better myself.

It seems like this discussion has frustrated you to the point of rudeness, which was not my intention.


Keep an open mind and a closed wallet... unless it\'s open to making a donation!

Hi,

I do not know much about the LOT theory other than what I have read on the post above, but my pro extender is used in the straight out and straight up position and I have stopped gaining. I am going to start doing 180 degree bundled stretches in the straight out and straight up directions in order to weaken the tunica, is this likely to make a difference?
If this does not make a difference I will think about trying to make my pro extender design about to be used for BTC or between the cheeks

cantlook,

If you have ever hanged you will know that you will not feel ligaments at all in the upper angles. OTS, at least I don’t feel nothing on the ligaments. I guess you could feel them if you didn’t do BTC first, but then you would have much more resistance in stretching.

So you should do BTC first so after your ligaments are stretched, you can start stressing inner and outer tunica without ligaments at all.

Way I see divide and conquer is that you just stress difference part of your penis at the time. You should also stretch your ligaments before doing RSDT fulcrum. RSDT is divide and conquer too. It stresses the top of the tunica and septum.

In my opinion, anyone that wants to start hanging should start with BTC and do it so long that they start to feel it in the inner shaft. Then continue this for a month or two and switch to RSDT/SO/OTS. Now he can stretch the shaft without ligaments robbing any stress from tunica/septum.


Hanging through the year 2012. Check my log.

Originally Posted by sheLovesIt
….

Because I believe that I have pulled out my inner penis and it seems like djrobins believes it is possible…..


This just demonstrate that people can believe the most ridicolous things. As explained here
marinera - Why Bib’s LOT Theory holds water

your penis is attached to the inferior fascia and to the fascia of Colles. Your penis is tied to your body from the inside, not only by the ligs. The sole way you can detache your penis by your body is cutting the corpora cavernosa.

Beside that, if your penis would be pulled ahead from the inside due to lose ligs, your penis would fall inside your testiscles. Beside that, you’d feel a void space between your anus and your testicles.

Were anatomy links required to show that? Do you think that Mother Nature would fix one of the most important organs for the survival of the specie in such a way that you could lose it by accident, cutting ligs that are outside of your body? Nope. Root of the penis is inside your body for a reason.

Think to how many stories you’d have heard, otherwise, about falling penises in battles or in accidents.

And : you have hairs on your shaft for the very simple reason that you have stretched the skin of your penis. No inner penis coming out, dude. No porn stars or hanger sellers that magically pull out their penis from the inside, remaining with a void perineum.

And after all, the the proof is under the sun: have you noticed that people who believe this bunch of nonsense on average gain in 10 years about the same than a guy who never bothered gain in one year or two?


Last edited by marinera : 03-09-2012 at .

Divide and conquer in a nutshell:

You can stretch different part of your penis with different angles. This requires less weight and its much easier than trying to stretch all at once. Sure, you can stretch all with BTC or SO but this usually requires huge amounts of weights when the time goes by. When you gain some experience with hanging, you can feel what is limiting your total length.


Hanging through the year 2012. Check my log.

Originally Posted by cantlook
…..

The tug back theory seems to me like the analysis of two or more muscle/ligament systems and how they relate to each other, but does not seem to give me any insight into how to make quicker gains.


Right. Strenght of ischiocavernosus muscle (ICIM), then how the penis is attached to the puboischial ram, then how is attached to the anterior surface of the body by the ligs, then the length of the penis, etc. etc..

Each of this variables will play a role - the foremost likely being the strength of ICM.

As a side note, men with a bigger penis will have, all other things being equal, a lower erection angle than average, because the penis will be heavier and the ICM will be squeezing a shorter (in proportion to the whole) part of the penis.

Originally Posted by cantlook
If that’s a shot at my having a “Commercial Account” I am not pedaling anything here either.

It seems like this discussion has frustrated you to the point of rudeness, which was not my intention.

Please ease up cantlook, you are jumping to conclusions. I did not notice your CA status.

I only get frustrated when people (not you BTW) act like they know it all.

People who say, “You can’t do this…. You can’t do that… “

I was hoping that I could bring some hope to guys who were having problems gaining. IMO Bib’s LOT Theory has been bashed too much on Thunders by people who are NOT hanging guru’s by any stretch of the imagination. If they were guru’s then there would be a more active hanging forum where guys are reporting regular gains.

Bib has helped literally thousands of guys with PE. Many report gains on a regular basis. And guess what, he uses his LOT Theory and a few other indicators that I have mentioned.

sheLovesIt

marinera,

You are so all over the place that I would not waste one single key stroke on a disussion with you. EVER!!!!!!
It would be great if you could stay out of my posts and I will stay out of yours. FOR LIFE !!!!!

sheLovesIt

If there is any PE ‘guru’, stay 1,000 miles far away from him. If you believe to gurus, you are going to be frustrated pretty often around here.

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