Thunder's Place

The big penis and mens' sexual health source, increasing penis size around the world.

New Bib Hanger users

just LOVE my new bib hanger (reg)

verteran pe’er, newbie to hanging

wow, i am LOVIN’ my new bib hanger, which I got about 3 weeks ago, no small thanks to bigger and to the forum for having pointing me in the right direction to finally becoming a member of the 8” club. you hangin’ dudes are AWESOME! THANKS!

i am currently 7” x 6” girth, non-bone pressed. (glans is like 2” across — big balls too). i started out before pe-ing at 5.5” almost 5 years ago (43 years old here) and have been doing vacuum pumping, jelq, and other stretching, as well as hanging as best i could (but always ending up frustrated when i tried to hang weight from my friggin’ penis).

a happy pumper

after several months of dedicated pumping i was SO happy to have an extra inch! — especially flaccid, because in lockerroom situations, my dick looked better alongside my big balls, instead of being weirdly dwarfed by the them. finally i truly looked hung! ALLRIGHT!

i thought that the best way to get that last inch would be the bib hanger, and i think i might be right! dudes, life is GOOD!

my routine

i have started a rigorous (at least one hour, 5x per week — more if I can) hanging routine until Christmas. At that point (and not until then) I will meaure my penis, and see if I am at 7.5, 7.75 or perhaps 8 friggin’ inches! dudes, can’t wait!

i already suspect that i’ve gained some length — certainly some girth — about which I am VERY HAPPY — I love how fat and chunky my penis looks after a nice hang — dudes life with a big penis IS VERY GOOD, I TELL YOU!

more about my new hanging routine

okay, more about my routine (sorry about this long post already). i have tried as many types of wrap as i have had hangs. i don’t really like the theraband, except that i use an extra long, thick length with knots tied in the ends which i loop through my toes and then attached the hanger to, to gain a weightless pull, which I can vary at will, and which goes perfectly when I am sitting watching tv on my couch. sometime i walk around this way, multi-tasking.

sometimes i attach my hanger to a long stretch of theraband fastened to different immovable things around the room — so i can vary the angle of the pull. sometimes i snap repeatedly at the taut theraband, which puts interesting pressure on my stretched penis. feels kinda good …

following the rules

i have been a VERY GOOD BOY in terms of starting with my new hanger really slow with low weights. the most i hung during the first week was about 7 pounds. now i hang ten pounds, and even 15 pounds for just several minutes. i am getting better at standing still and just taking it, rather than running around my apartment multi-tasking, as i find you get more of a tendency for slippage when you move too much.

between the cheeks? hmmm, sounds kinda gay …

i have just started experimenting with btc. AWESOME! really really nice feel, so I look forward to doing that A LOT. i guess between the cheeks is the WAY to go!

i’ve started doing bicep curls and other weights while i’m hanging, in order to try to get more buff. not a bad thing either.

i am somewhat of an artist, so i have a feeling i’m still gonna be be doing a lot of multi-tasking while i hang, and i am glad i can just be productive at the same time i’m “growing” my friggin’ penis!

some useless personal info, sorry

i live in s small one bedroom apartment, but it’s my own, so i have all the privacy i need. lucky for me, as sometimes i do pe morning, noon and night!

i tend to still do vacuum pumping, jelqing, and other forms of pe along with my bib hanging. i just really want to max out the bib hanging — maybe get up to 18-20 lbs for long stretches. and see if that penis of mine will ever come up with 8 thick inches it deserves to be. (puuu-lease, dear god ……. puuu-lease!)

(i suppose that once i get eight, i am going to want nine, and this pe experiment will last the rest of my life. there are worse things …)

bib hanging problems

okay, some of my bib hanging concerns: the worst thing that happens is the bib hanger tends to slip down in the course of the “set” and then my glans is all misshappen and weird looking, from getting pressed by the bunched up skin and the bib hanger itself. (i just read about “squeezing” the blood out of your glans before clamping down, so i am going to try that.)

also, after a long hang my glans gets little like blood blisters and bruises which i don’t like at all, and which i use a heat pad and a lot of jelq type blood circulating massage in between my sets to try to avoid that.

i also hang weights from my balls and do short vacuum pumps of my dick and my balls between my bib hanging sets, as the variety seems to keep my penis happy and lively, i.e., the blood circulating, and with a nice healthy reddish color & of course plump.

short glans vacuum pumping aside here

i recently have been uniquely pumping my glans with this special “head tube,” (from newart.com) and i can even keep that on while i hang, and it seems for some reason to really help against slippage.

wrap experimentation

wraps i have been trying: theraband, ace bandage, cyber skin (best), some latex “pleasure ring” type cylinders i have, bicycle inner tube, nothing.

btw, the latex products react with the gel on the hanger and can ruined the latex. so if i use the latex cylinders, i do a second wrap of ace bandage so they don’t come into contact with each other.

i am liking wrapping and attaching while i’m hard or “half chubby” for some reason. i tend to love hanging with a hard-on and while in a sort of “crab” position (i.e., all four limbs on the floor or bed) just swinging my weighted dick around to beat the band, almost bringing myself to orgasm, etc.

btw, regarding the construction of the hanger, I think the gel part is the most vulnerable — as different oils and other latex can ruin this type of material. so, i am going to keep it as pristine as possible, but basically being a KLUTZ here, i wouldn’t be surprised if i’ll need to be replacing the gel layer sometime in the future.

my “plan”

i have 2 each of: one lb., two lb., three lb., five lb., and ten pound weights. i tend to vary whatever weight i hang depending on “feel,” rather than any set regimen. i really have to be more dedicated about setting up a strict, goal-oriented regimen, maxing out the weight, right? and keeping to set increments of 15 or 20 minutes, right?

basically, this is how a typical hanging session for me goes: i have been tending to start with 5 lbs. while i multi-task around my apartment for a set of two sets (i.e., 1 or 2 15 minute increments), then i do a set with eight lbs. while i crab around in near-orgiastic ecstasy (yummm!), then i do an sedentary “endurance” set of 10 lb., maybe adding 5 lbs. for several minutes, so i can say i’ve hung 15 lbs., even though it’s just a couple of minutes. really gritting my teeth and watching the clock. after it’s done i feel incredibly proud — just like a good workout at the gym!

but

i plan to really get into some serious stretching, ligament tearing hangs in the near future — like this weekend! — and to post some nice meaty gains around the holiday, okay? i don’t want to do any damage, as i know that only means one thing: a set-back from my penis enlargement goals, and having to stop hanging for awhile. so, i plan to move ever cautiously forward …

i don’t know what else to say, i’m just having a lot of fun finally hanging some decent weight from my friggin’ penis. THANKS TO THE BRILLIANT BIB HANGER AND THE INDUSTRIOUS, GENEROUS MR. BIGGER! THANKS DUDE!

i believe i have a real FEEL for techniques to make my penis bigger, and i think this bib hanger is the real ticket.

bill in washington dc

(by the way, i’m gay, so i can say stuff like “between the cheeks sounds gay, man,” whereas if you’re straight you probably shouldn’t been discriminatory in that way, okay? just joking, really trying to be cool in the ultimately ever-so-cool forum i found)

(oh my way, i’m really glad i got the regular bib hanger, rather than the starter. the starter would probably have been too small. even when i’m just at “half chubby” and with just one layer of wrap, sometimes i find it hard to muscle the bib hanger onto my meat — i know this isn’t recommended, but it seems to be working for me …

peace out! carry on!


Bill

Hey bill,

I think you had better stop using the hanger for a sex toy and read the Product Guide once or twice before you seriously hurt yourself. DO NOT, REPEAT, DO NOT HANG ERECT! If your hanger is slipping, you have an attachment problem, before you move up in weight, figure out what that problem is and learn how to fix it. My guess would be you need to work on your wrapping or hanger adjustments. Also, stop pumping in between hanging sets, all that is doing is drawing more fluid into your cock and making it easier for the hanger to slip.

Other than that, welcome aboard!!!


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billinwashdc,

Wow, what a hell of a post. I am glad you like the hanger, but we need to go over some stuff.

>i have started a rigorous (at least one hour, 5x per week — more if I can) hanging routine until Christmas. At that point (and not until then) I will meaure my penis, and see if I am at 7.5, 7.75 or perhaps 8 friggin’ inches! dudes, can’t wait!<

With the above in mind, I have some suggestions.

>i have tried as many types of wrap as i have had hangs.i don’t really like the theraband, except that i use an extra long, thick length with knots tied in the ends which i loop through my toes and then attached the hanger to, to gain a weightless pull, which I can vary at will, and which goes perfectly when I am sitting watching tv on my couch. sometime i walk around this way, multi-tasking.<

This is good, but do not forget about the Theraband. You may have some other issues about the hanger which have made the Theraband uncomfortable. Did you try it with a cloth underwrap?

>i have been a VERY GOOD BOY in terms of starting with my new hanger really slow with low weights. the most i hung during the first week was about 7 pounds. now i hang ten pounds, and even 15 pounds for just several minutes. i am getting better at standing still and just taking it, rather than running around my apartment multi-tasking, as i find you get more of a tendency for slippage when you move too much.<

Ok, the hanger should be very solid whether you move around or not. The evidence mounts.

>i tend to still do vacuum pumping, jelqing, and other forms of pe along with my bib hanging. i just really want to max out the bib hanging — maybe get up to 18-20 lbs for long stretches. and see if that penis of mine will ever come up with 8 thick inches it deserves to be. (puuu-lease, dear god ……. puuu-lease!)<

Be SURE that you do not do any of the other stuff before hanging. Pumping, jelqing etc will make the skin more sensitive which will preclude hanging. Sometimes, with a heavy jelq session, the skin will be too irritated to hang the next day.

>okay, some of my bib hanging concerns: the worst thing that happens is the bib hanger tends to slip down in the course of the “set” …also, after a long hang my glans gets little like blood blisters and bruises which i don’t like at all, and which i use a heat pad and a lot of jelq type blood circulating massage in between my sets to try to avoid that….oh my way, i’m really glad i got the regular bib hanger, rather than the starter. the starter would probably have been too small. even when i’m just at “half chubby” and with just one layer of wrap, sometimes i find it hard to muscle the bib hanger onto my meat — i know this isn’t recommended, but it seems to be working for me …<

Taking the above statements, and with the other clues, I do not think you have found or maybe experimented with the adjustments found within the right skid. There is no way that a six inch girth should be even close to too big for a regular, or that you should have to “muscle” the hanger on. Check out a couple of different settings for the outer hex nuts, NOT the wing nuts. Always make sure the wing nuts are tight before hanging.

After a little while, go back and read the product guide. It will make more sense.

>btw, the latex products react with the gel on the hanger and can ruined the latex. so if i use the latex cylinders, i do a second wrap of ace bandage so they don’t come into contact with each other.<

It will not react with latex. Theraband is latex. It will however, react with any adhesive, such as found on tape. That is why scotch tape is better.

>i am liking wrapping and attaching while i’m hard or “half chubby” for some reason. i tend to love hanging with a hard-on and while in a sort of “crab” position (i.e., all four limbs on the floor or bed) just swinging my weighted dick around to beat the band, almost bringing myself to orgasm, etc.<

Make sure you completely subside before actually hanging weight. Some guys like to wrap and attach semi-hard, but then wait a bit before adding weight.

>btw, regarding the construction of the hanger, I think the gel part is the most vulnerable — as different oils and other latex can ruin this type of material. so, i am going to keep it as pristine as possible, but basically being a KLUTZ here, i wouldn’t be surprised if i’ll need to be replacing the gel layer sometime in the future.<

I have replaced the gel on one hanger so far. My original is still in good shape, but I do not use it very often. BTW, I do not know of any type of oil that will hurt the gel.

The biggest problem with the gel is that it is held on by pressure. The hanger must be tight enough to handle the weight you wish to hang. That is why the slipping issue bothers me. Either you do not have the hanger adjusted correctly, or it is not tight enough. Remember, when you swing the weight, etc, it will cause and actual, momentary increase in the effective amount of weight, so you must allow for that.

>i have 2 each of: one lb., two lb., three lb., five lb., and ten pound weights. i tend to vary whatever weight i hang depending on “feel,” rather than any set regimen.<

Good. I like that.

> i really have to be more dedicated about setting up a strict, goal-oriented regimen, maxing out the weight, right? and keeping to set increments of 15 or 20 minutes, right?<

No, I like the way you put it above. Go by feel. You will have a max weight, but it is not a goal! Do not feel like you have failed if at some point you cannot hang your previous max weight. The goal is gains, not amount of weight hung, right? Try to always be comfortable, and relax.

I have every confidence that with your attitude, you will reach whatever goals you set. Really good post. Any questions, fire away. Please go into the adjustments thing and let me know.

Bigger

thanks for the quick resopnse/excellent advice

dear thunder/bigger —

wow really for sorry that toooooo long post of mine, i am much too verbose. and thanks for your quick responses.

anyhoo, thanks again for the excellent forum, and the excellent, nay, **brilliant** hanger!

hard-on

hey, what can i say, trying to put on the wrap and bib hanger invariably gives me a ragin’ hard-on. i tried beating it off first, but afterwards i have NO interest in hanging. for me, it is a sex toy, and it is erotic. sorry, but i don’t think i can change that.

maybe this is not the right place for me, maybe i am not serious enough about hanging. is that one/two or three strikes against me? (better bump me NOW rather than later dude!)

i have read the instructions nine or twelve times — but yes i will read them again, and they are more clear as i get practice (a diagram would have been helpful — toe, skid, etc. mean little when you’re looking at the thing for the first time — right, left have no meaning for me still — call me an idiot, i called myself a klutz already, and i promise not to mind any more aspersions. maybe my thymous gland is just TOO big…)

gents, but what is so dire about hanging while hard? — i presume breaking a lig? but what about thrombosis of a vein/artery? i mean, you just say: DON’T HANG ERECT. where is the discussion about what are the repercussions of hanging hard? point me to the thread — i have read a lot of the threads, and will look forward to more.

NEVER HANG WHILE ERECT! that’s all the guide says about that. why do i need to re-read that, pray tell why?

it seems i can hang low weights (say 5-7 lbs.) from my totally ragingly erect penis with the bib hanger with no problems — is there some sort of accumulated damage over time i need to worry about? i have a corking straight up erection — in fact i want it to bend more horizontal, and i’ve found stretching and hanging has been good for this.

wraps and adjustments

certainly i need to experiment a lot more with the wraps and the adjustments — i will keep trying to make the theraband work for the big weights to work … the latex products do seem to be the best wrap. i like sometimes using the cloth wrap against my skin, but of course it leaves a painful indentation when you take it off — but i will continue to experiment with that too. the slippage is really minor, the bunched skin just runs up against my glans ard really mashes it and sort of bruises it and it takes awhile to return to its shape.

i will continue to let the hard-on subside for the heavy weight sets i am doing, and try to make sure as much fluid as possible is out of my penis. that sounds like sound advice.

i have usually been getting a good hold and hanging 10 lbs. very well the past few time … i’ll keep at it and let you know what happens. i really don’t want to damage my penis so i’m going to continue to be careful as i slowly progress.

bill in washington dc
thanks again for the support and the excellent forum!!!!!!


Bill

Hey dcbill,

Exuberance and long posts won’t get you banned. In fact they are refreshing. Now the overuse of the word “dude”, that may be a different story dude. :D

The erect thing. I’ll let Bigger give you all the technical details, but the idea behind hanging is “controlled damage”, not ripping your cock out by the root. The possibility of doing PE career ending damage to yourself by hanging erect and putting a severe tear in a lig or two is real. Try putting your wrap on and the hanger. Then leave your dick alone until it goes flaccid. Then readjust/tighten the hanger and add the weight. Check the tightness of the hanger after you have added the weight.

The Product Guide will become clearer to you as you get more time in your hanger. Also, have you read all the excellent posts by Bigger in this forum?? If not, do a search using Bib in this forum and it will give you some more good reading.


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billinwashdc,

>hey, what can i say, trying to put on the wrap and bib hanger invariably gives me a ragin’ hard-on. i tried beating it off first, but afterwards i have NO interest in hanging. for me, it is a sex toy, and it is erotic. sorry, but i don’t think i can change that.<

Others have reported this problem. You are not alone. Just try and let it subside before you put on heavier weights.

>gents, but what is so dire about hanging while hard? — i presume breaking a lig? but what about thrombosis of a vein/artery? i mean, you just say: DON’T HANG ERECT. where is the discussion about what are the repercussions of hanging hard? point me to the thread — i have read a lot of the threads, and will look forward to more. <

It has been a while since this discussion has taken place, so I will put in a word or two about it. First, the only serious injury I have heard of from hanging occured to a guy named Forgedcrank who was hanging erect, and had a mild case of peyronies and was hanging with a loop. He tore his tunica. It had to be surgically repaired.

It is really simple physics, placing stresses lengthwise on the tunica, while lateral forces are already in place (erection). The same goes for any torsion to the shaft while hanging. Try tearing a sheet of paper by grasping each end and simply pulling. Hard to do. But if you place a lateral force on the paper while pulling, it tears easily.

Most penis injuries occur during sex from a bending force to an erect penis, spraining or tearing the tunica.

>NEVER HANG WHILE ERECT! that’s all the guide says about that. why do i need to re-read that, pray tell why?<

After having a little experience, you need to re-read the product guide because it will make more sense. The whole thing, not just about the hanging erect.

>it seems i can hang low weights (say 5-7 lbs.) from my totally ragingly erect penis with the bib hanger with no problems — is there some sort of accumulated damage over time i need to worry about? i have a corking straight up erection — in fact i want it to bend more horizontal, and i’ve found stretching and hanging has been good for this.<

I do not know of any accumulated damage that will occur. Any damage would probably be immediate.

Good luck,

Bigger

WOW! What a great series of posts.
But - my eyes are sore from reading all this.

Dude (sorry Thunder),

One of the main benefits of this forum is the experience of the members. I can tell you from experience that hanging can injure you if you don’t do it right. I can guarantee that you will eventually damage your ligs, tunica or other soft tissue if you hang erect. You can take this advice or not. As you go up in weight, the chance of injury increases dramatically, so be careful before piling on the plates.

Good luck

Jelktoid


Jelktoid :trash: More meat for the money!

sigh, what to do with that raging hard-on ...

Hey big thanks you guys!

I will really try to subside my purple/blue erection before I hang the big weights, which I want to be sooner rather than later, and I DON’T want to wait for some big problem to heal.

Hmmmm, anybody got any salt peter?

I have been so cautious about this PE thing ever since I started about 5 years ago (and as you probably know vacuum pumps are VERY tricky), so CAUTION is definitely my word.

(And yes, I admit “dude” is too, I was using it like over ten years ago — the sexiest word in the English language as far as I’m concerned).

(I also have to admit how I feel tragically caught between the Gen X generation and the Baby Boom one, a sort of Captain Without a Team or, as my leadership abilities are pretty nil, perhaps rather a Player Without a Team … sigh …)

Anyhoo, all in all, I AM JUST LOVING my new bib hanger, because it’s finally allowing me to hang some significant weight from my friggin’ penis, what I was trying to do by all sorts of impossible, kinky means for such a long time, and this is the best ticket to the elusive 8” club as far as I’m concerned!

I am actually quite looking forward to continued experimentation with the wraps, the adjustments, and various different routines, and I don’t consider it frustrating at all. I also look very much forward to reading more posts, and posting the occasional one myself (though I am something of a lurker — all these admissions, gosh!).

And by the way, I went to the bib hanging site, and I did finally find the excellent (and I mean very topnotch, graphically perfect and aesthetically pleasing) DIAGRAM, which somehow I had neglected before, which I have printed and added to the other material I printed from the website, and to which I refer regularly.

Keep it hanging, dudes! You guys are definitely awesome!

bill in washington dc
(billinwashdc@aol.com)

(By the way, to any hangers who ever make it to DC on business or pleasure, I would definitely like to do a hang session or two with you all, as I am interested in speeding up this dang slow learning curve. No strings or sex of course, just plain male hanging & bonding, ok?)


Bill

billinwashdc;

When you post to this board, please do not include any sexual overtones to other members. Some find it to be offensive, and are here for one reason PE!

Thanks!

Modemmer.

what to do wth ...

okay, yessir!

i will do my best not to make any sexual overtones to other members when referring to our practice of hanging weights from our penises …

i just reread my post and don’t find any overt sexual references except the one that referred back to bib’s reply to me, so i’m really sorry if you misconstrued it as as come-on or somthing … which it definitely is not … i have only the utmost respect for each and every member of the forum … and am not interested in making sexual overtones to anyone here … sorry if i offended you or somebody else …

bill in wash dc


Bill

thanks again and renewed apologies

hey guys,

just want to make sure there are no hard feelings and definitely do not go backwards to read my too long post, very boring and verbose. jeeze sorry about potentially offending anybody there with my overt gayness and all. thanks for the extreme tolerance in your generous replies and advice, especially the AWESOME BIG! Hope you had a great vacation man!

i think i have culled the information i need from thunder and big.

gosh, i am so hyper sensitive to criticism, i really don’t know what to do about that — part of my innate nature, i guess — why i don’t post much and lurk most of the time. i’m looking forward to trying to get through more of the threads.

last night i tried the theraband OVERwrap and the ace bandage UNDERwrap. that works best yet. went for three 20 minute sets: 10 lbs., 8 lbs., then 5 lbs. pretty easy overall, and not much slippage and i was multi-tasking around my apartment very pleasantly.

still my dick looked totally beat and gnarly by the end of the session. next morning he was back to normal, and, seemingly, thicker and longer too … yippee! (of course skin is kind of tender). i am figuring the “gnarly look” — head kind of bruised looking and mashed — skin indented with the marks of the ace bandage under wrap — is normal and just par for the course.

will keep at it. am going to take today off and maybe friday, in anticipation of some really long hangs over the weekend.

think i’m gonna go back to lurking for awhile, maybe check out some other boards. will surface around the holidays (or before) with reports with ruler in hand, praying for 8”.

and would really appreciate some of the other guys with new bib hangers reporting some of their successes, frustrations, etc.

carry on!

bill in wash dc


Bill

billinwashdc,

>still my dick looked totally beat and gnarly by the end of the session. next morning he was back to normal, and, seemingly, thicker and longer too … yippee! (of course skin is kind of tender). i am figuring the “gnarly look” — head kind of bruised looking and mashed — skin indented with the marks of the ace bandage under wrap — is normal and just par for the course.<

Some guys have good luck with Ace bandage, but I never did. It was simply too rough for me, and irritated the skin in much the manner you described. I found a soft thin sweat shirt material to be best for an underwrap.

If the head is bruised and mashed with a max of ten lbs, you probably are not tightening quite enough. Try a smoother, thinner underwrap, and tighten a little more.

Bigger

very good idea

tightening more

yes, i have been tightening more and having better luck — i am able to subside my erection by just being patient putting it on, then walking around multi-tasking (this guy must have ADD or something — so much multi-tasking going on, gosh …).

then, after time, it goes down, though the head is still pretty engorged, cause i think the bib hanger acts like a sort of a cockring.

cotton sweatshirt inner wrap

and, yes, i think the sweat shirt material is the ticket — or just t-shirt material — as i like to keep my wrap as thin as possible.

and using the theraband on the outside of the wrap is key, cause of the way it grips the bib. why i was focused on the other way around, i don’t know — i guess i thought the smoothness of the theraband would obliviate the indentation left on my shaft …

but i found it would bunch and make for a thick messy wrap — the other way, with the theraband on the outside makes for a very tight wrap, and it’s easy to avoid the “pinch.”

any btw, btc is next

i am really looking forward to getting a good hang btc — that’s next — when i’m confident that “nothing’s going on wrong down there” — and can just kick back and relax (well, endure) with 15 or more pounds stretching my cock like it’s never been stretched before — wish me luck!

carry on!

bill in washington, dc


Bill

Bill,

After you have wrapped and subsided, lightly grasp the wrap bundle and push toward the head. This will allow the blood in the head to escape back toward the base, and then you can apply the hanger.

Bigger

I am sitting at my computer hanging with my Bib Starter as we speak, and so far it has been an interesting experience. Right now I am unable to work so I have all day to hang. I started hanging on 9/8 and did 2 sets with 2.5 lbs, then tried 5 lbs and made it about 3 min. The next day I did 2.5 lbs the first set then did 5 lbs for 2 sets of 20min. Yesterday I did 5 lbs for 2 sets of 20 min then tried 7.5 lbs abd made it about 5 min- so I did 7.5 lbs 3 more sets of 5 min. All of the above was done laying down with the weight over the ‘foot’ end of the bed. Today, I am reading a lot on the comp so I started with 7.5 lbs and have hung 6 sets of 7.5 lbs for 20 min so far and will keep going until I am done reading posts. I may try 10 lbs, toward the end of the day. I am taking 10 min between sets for stretching and massage. My biggest issue so far is adjusting the hanger for comfort. I have a small flaccid penis so the hanger tends to ride up to the head. I am currently trying a toe out to put more pressure further back the shaft and it seems to be working well. I still feel like most of my efforts are going into skin stretching, but I do feel the ligs pulling a bit. Will keep you posted.

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