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When I have made great gains, I...

Shiver quote;
“If you are training a conventional routine then mm measurements are worse than useless as there are too many factors at play, which will only confuse the observer and not provide a clear path of action (which is what I believe you are mapping out with your PI methods).”

I tend to agree with you on this one.

“Imho PI’s are a great thing to develop for damage training, as it is akin to a body builder learning to know his body and adapt his routine to suit the feedback.”

Yes, exactly! So with your current routine you feel you are causing zero damage?

I have been working along the same lines, but obviously I am using more force and causing some micro trauma. I have also come to the conclusion that trauma should be minimized. I am trying to find that “just right” amount that will allow for stretching of the tissue without causing a tissue contraction reaction.

When I read episodes of some lucky bastards doing 5-10 minutes of some simple jelquing routine and making 2 inch gains in 3-6 months, I really suspect that they stumbled on to that magic amount.
Further, it seems that they run into much less limiting factors caused by fibrotic tissue build up.

I am hoping my studying PI’s that more of us can find that magical place…and develop magical dicks!


I definitely believe its possible to overdo it - especially by doing marathon jelq workouts. You end up suffering so much cumulative trauma that the tissues have no chance to bounce back.

I’ve noticed this with stretching as well. If you stretch too long and with a lot of intensity, it seems that the tissues tend to tighten. I try to maintain that fine line between loosening & tightening.

I’ve also noticed that my gains come in clumps, and I’m not sure why. I’ve gained in several such notable clumps:
(1) 0.22” EL in only 3 weeks after a 2-month break
(2) 7.5mm in one 28-day period
(3) 5.5mm in 12 days (Man, if I could’ve kept that up!)
But then….nothing.

After a positive workout, my unit is plumped up, fatigued but not exhausted, and my woodies are 100% within about 30-45 min after (erections are slightly compromised for that brief post-workout interval - but not much after).

And I’ll record gains quickly….which quickly stop. This seems to be the great mystery of PE. I realize that to maintain 5.5mm gains every 12 days would be to gain 6.59” in one year (that would never happen), but why do my gains quickly STOP? If I could’ve gained 5.5mm in 12 days, why not 2 or 3mm the next couple weeks, then maybe 2mm per month, etc.?

But with PE gains, at least for me, it tends to be feast or famine. Do the tissues really adapt that quickly? If so, maybe we need to keep rotating our workouts (i.e., a jelq-intense cycle followed by mostly stretching, then back again, etc.).

But thats what it signifies to me. If I applied enough time under load (TUL) to grow 5.5mm in 12 days, you’d think that it could’ve carried me somewhat further, albeit at a slower rate. But the gains stopped cold. They exploded from out of nowhere, then vanished just as suddenly. That would suggest that I found my T.I.T.T., but quickly adapted (within only 2-3 weeks). That time frame keeps cropping up whenever I peruse my old .xls sheets.


Slowly changing one variable at a time like this, will take some time to figure things out, probably several weeks!

I have also noticed there are times when it seems to shrink for an hour or so, then fluff out. Any ideas what this means anyone? Microtears were caused and now it’s healing?

One area we are all looking at is off days. Shiver is playing with it and you have mentioned it in regards to bodybuilding. I have wondered too, I think I will point some time into that first. Change nothing but off days, and observe more carefully the other things. Maybe waiting 3, 5 or 7 days would do something. Do you happen to have any links to these fast gains threads, by chance?

Start a dialogue! The Gay Role Poll is waiting for your vote! :)

All truth goes through three stages: First it is ridiculed. Then it is violently opposed. Finally it is accepted as self evident. -Schopenhauer

I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world. -Richard Dawkins

I always shrink for a while if I overdue it but I’m not sure that’s a bad thing or a good thing. I made great gains from jelqing but then my gains stopped but I’m not sure if it’s because I started to over-train or not because my reaction to slowing gains has been to add more work. Maybe I should have did less who knows maybe less is more at least that has always been my thought with girth. When my gains had stopped from jelqing I switched to hanging and immediately got pretty good gains but after a while they slowed to a crawl and I upped my weight more and more until I started getting a bruising problem that wouldn’t go away so I stopped hanging and took a break. Than I took three months off and started hanging with the wench and all was well and I had a un-cemented gain again but I started with the bib again and the bruising came back so I stopped hanging again and took a couple more weeks off. My work out now consist of jelqing and erect jelqing with some squeezes and clamping and I do this 5 days a week for a .5 to .75 minutes a day and I seem to be getting some great results. I think I had lost some girth except on the base from hanging well not from hanging just from doing no girth exercises for almost a year but it’s back now. I don’t measure much because it’s depressing when I don’t get a gain I know my dick so well I can pretty much feel a gain while I’m pe’ing I know exactly how muck sticks out when I’m holding with two hands. One thing that I can say jelqing makes my dick feel a lot more healthy then hanging. So I have got gains in many different ways so I can’t say for sure what was the best way but what I can say is that sooner or later with any exercise you get less of a return and after a while you need a break or you need to switch exercises.

I haven't failed, I've found 10,000 ways that don't work. Thomas Edison (1847-1931)

I think my best gains have occurred when I backed off the intensity and eliminated discoloration. When I began PE, my tendency was to go overboard be it jelqing or pumping and I lived with the resulting discoloration for a long time. Although I got perceived gains, it may have been more swelling then gaining and much of it did not cement.

PE is based on the principle of causing micro-tears, so if you are causing discoloration, you have gone past the micro level, which by definition can’t be seen with the naked eye. So all of my efforts now are to exercise without causing discoloration so I always describe it as a moderate intensity level.

I also warm up after my warm up. That is, after the hot wrap, I begin the exercises slowly for the first several minutes and build intensity as I go instead of starting right off at a level I will be finishing at. So if my goal is to finish pumping at 7 in hg, I always begin at 4 and spend several minutes there before raising the pressure in increments to 5, then 6, then 7. Same with jelqing, give your cock time to come up to your full jelqing pressures. This is a big factor in eliminating discoloration from burst capillaries.

I also end each session with an erect massage. This allows you to spend additional time at your post workout size and aids in cementing your gains, and finishing your workout with good circulating blood flow, which also reduces discoloration. Ending with an erection is also a good sign you haven’t gone overboard during your PE session.

Finally, if you keep your sessions at moderate levels, I don’t see any reason why you can’t do PE on a daily basis. This plays into my size memory theory of building on the previous days result in order to change your cocks size memory to a larger one. Too much rest time just allows your cock to return to it’s original size memory and slows your progress.

In order to do PE on a daily basis, I vary the intensity levels form day to day. So, for say 3 days I will go moderate hard and then do a day of moderate to light. In pumping terms that would be the difference between pumping to 7 in hg for 3 days and then just 6 in hg for 1 day.

The first sign of gains for me was an apparent increase in the amount of skin I had on my cock when I was flaccid. My first thought was (I was a real newbie to PE and was only pumping), If this is all PE does, I don’t need it. But I kept at PE and when I had gained an inch in L and a little girth, I had grown into this new skin from the inside and I looked perfectly normal again when flaccid. Skin expansion/growth for future gains must have been slower because I never again noticed more than normal skin.

To answer your original question, Sparky, I would guess that gprent and I have pretty much the same philosophy about PE in that we both come to it with as much emphasis on erectile function as we do on size gains. There is no point in going through all this time-consuming work to build an 8 x 6 or whatever if that unit does not work perfectly and potentially better than the smaller one used to.

As for workouts - no mattter what those workouts happen to be - if my pattern of nocturnal/morning erections is not its usual frequency, I assume that I have either overdone something in PE or that my Life stress levels are unusually high or that I am just tired from doing whatever in normal life, or that my ED meds are cooling off. (I have had ED for some years but that is very much under control.)

If sexual erections become slower to happen or are not hard enough for me to perform, I look at the same issues as above.

If my libido drops off, ditto.

The best advice I can give has already been mentioned by gprent. If you normally have no erectile dysfunction and you can’t end a PE session with a good hard-on, you have very likely overdone some aspect of your PE. Ending with an erection is to me the best sign that I have done everything right. Ideally, PE should end with your feeling turned-on, not turned-off. You should leave it feeling a somewhat “horny” edge and for the rest of the day you should be able to have sex (in whatever form you prefer) if that comes your way an hour, or eight hours later.

For me, no gain should result in any loss of erectile function. And, because of the great vascular and tissue exercise PE gives, it should over time provide you more sponstaneous erections during the day than you had before you took up PE and (hopefully) better performance in bed and when you are having sex with yourself.



Avocet8, I haven’t got time to see if you have said this before or not right now, What was your starting size and what is your size now? I am gonna start pumping when I heal. Does it disfigure your penis at all?

Previously known as rundown.

Originally Posted by CiderMan
Avocet8, I haven’t got time to see if you have said this before or not right now, What was your starting size and what is your size now? I am gonna start pumping when I heal. Does it disfigure your penis at all?

Said it before and will no doubt say it again:

Started PE at exactly 6 x 5.75. Now I don’t measure much anymore but when I do I’m either 8 L or a bit above or below and 6.00 or so G. In my case (I have ED and use those PDE5 drugs), if I have taken either Cialis or Viagra recently my girth goes to about 6.25. On average, 8 x 6, though, and I am a very happy camper with that.

It seems important to say, especially at this time of year, that I have kept up with PE for 4 years now. I am very lazy at it these days, just enough to keep my gains, PE a couple times a week is all, if that; once a week at least.

I do use perforeal’s suggestion of a TheraP or ACE wrap every day for a few hours which keeps my flaccid size (that was VERY hard for me to gain) intact. I used to be 2.5 L on a good day, flaccid.

All things considered, I would not turn anything about my PE experience around. I am very happy with my erect and flaccid size now and don’t want any more.

Well, if the Dick Fairy gave me more, OK. :) But I don’t resent any of the work I did to get here. Now, I’d just rather talk you guys into gaining more than work on that for myself.



Its 1100 pm my time, just got in after a long difficult weekend, and am beat.

I want to address all the recent posts, especially the ones that I sent a personal PM requesting. Thank you again for answering, it is all excellent info and I really see a pattern shaping up that we can capitalize on.

Tomorrow I will have some more time, and will post at greater length.



Well I have officially gained 1/4” BPEL, and 1/16” girth in my first month of PE. I just posted the details in my pics thread and my progress thread.

How do you know if it’s cemented or not? How do you tell?

Now I need to ‘freeze’ everything, and just change one variable at a time. I still don’t know which one for sure.

Start a dialogue! The Gay Role Poll is waiting for your vote! :)

All truth goes through three stages: First it is ridiculed. Then it is violently opposed. Finally it is accepted as self evident. -Schopenhauer

I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world. -Richard Dawkins

After 4 years of PE and a myriad of techniques implemented, it’s actually somewhat difficult to distill exactly what were the definite signs of gains to come. But, I’ll say that when gains came steadily, my dick always felt healthy and getting erections were easy to arouse.

Also, even when I overdid the time/pressure with pumping and my dick “shrank” the next day due to abuse, as long as I gave it a 2-3 day rest, it bounced back to life and usually slightly bigger. That’s when I realized that I could overcome my newbie dick abuse with an appropriate amount of time-off and rest.

I rarely get this feeling anymore, but when I was making my best length gains, I used to feel a slight internal “tingling” or “itchy” sensation in my dickshaft. It wasn’t uncomfortable, just sort of “odd”.


Forum Guidelines PAST: 5.25"L x 4.75"G (base),EBP (January 2001) / PRESENT: 7.50"L x 7.00G (base),EBP It doesn't happen overnight! Commitment! Focus! Patience!/ Main Routine = Pumping/Jelqing/clamping + Homedic TheraP or ACE Wrap TheraP or ACE Wrap

Thanks for that peforeal!

That sounds like my “tingles” and “twing-twangs” (me and my silly words!) :)

Weird little feelings that just happen randomly throughout the day. No real pattern to it. Down at the base, in the middle, just all over the place. I took a three day break over the christmas weekend, and again this last weekend. It wasn’t planned that way, but turned out that way. I don’t think it hurt anything though.

Start a dialogue! The Gay Role Poll is waiting for your vote! :)

All truth goes through three stages: First it is ridiculed. Then it is violently opposed. Finally it is accepted as self evident. -Schopenhauer

I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world. -Richard Dawkins

Once again, thank you to everyone who has posted and especially those who have responded to my PM’s!

This is really great info, and I really see the pattern that I was expecting.

Once again, I am really pressed for time, hopefully later today I can post more at length.


Excellent, Excellent! I would suggest keeping vacuum the same, and just add one short set if you want to change a variable. I would suggest to add an additional 5-10 minute set, and just give it at least a few days and monitor your PI’s for how it is affecting you.

Actually, better yet…don’t change anything. You are making great gains now, I would stay with what you are doing until the gains stop.

I think one of the biggest mistakes we all make is to ADD to a already productive routine, which may then push it right out of the “gain zone” and make it difficult to get it back!

Stick with this for now, and when gains stop…lets talk! Until then RESIST the urge to add more!

Remember in PE as in bodybuilding or strength building…MORE IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER!!!!!!!!!



By the way, don’t worry about “cementing” just stay with what you are doing. Continued growth is the best “cement”!

Enjoy the gains, do your routine, get on with life…don’t worry about it.

Treat it like a regular part of the day…do it and forget about it. Time will take care of the rest. Like I said, once the gains stop, then we can talk about where to go from there.

Until then, enjoy the best of the PE times…an honest to goodness growth period!

Oh yeah, make notes of all the things you notice about your PI’s…and then report them here! :)





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