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Understanding force thresholds for growth

OK Xeno and MM,

Lets see if we can gather a range of wts where guys have seen good gains.

I would divide it into good gains that only lasted briefly (plastic deformation?) and good gains that continued for more than a couple months.

Maybe we could couple this with subjective descriptions like “good stretch”, “uncomfortable”, “pleasant”…etc.

Monty has been getting good gains in the 10-17lb range, gains that only slow because he hasn’t been hanging.

I think we CAN find a range where guys can get growth with minimal toughening reaction.

If we can give some ranges, like in pumping, it should make it easier for guys to find what works best for them by watching PI’s.

I’m telling you guys…I think we are moving this toward a reproducible science.

Originally Posted by sparkyx
How do you determine when you are properly deconditioned?


This is not even speculation; merely a single observation.

Approximately 8 months after having stopped hanging (including all other PE related activities, except sex and Kegels), mine still had the conditioned look and feel of veiny, masculine, mostly semi-rigid flaccid; especially morning flaccid was almost always right up with my better PE days FL’s, even after 8 months. Then just the next week, it went back to its pre PE presence and stayed that way. At the time no significant changes otherwise to my generally good physical health; no illness.

I wasn’t thrilled about loosing the PE flaccid. but I was fairily sure it was well and truly back to fresh noob; like nothing had happened, except the extra BPEL/EG. I only jelqed etc for 3 months then hung for 7, never heavier than 15#.

I’ve got nothing else to suggest that a full 8 months would be the optimal decon break in this particular case; just the PI slope was too flat to notice between 0 and 8 months post that active PE period.

rm

Great thread!

I have been PE`ing for about a year now and my gains have mostly been knowledge. I think one of the more common things that people do is overwork. This is what I did in the beginning. If one keep PE`ing and do not quit after a couple of months I think it is common to start thinking that one should do more or add to intensity. Taking breaks seems like two steps back and taking extended breaks of several months is like a sin.

My PE-sessions have always been quite moderate both time wise and intensity wise. After a 6 month plateau I managed to sneak in 1month of no PE. When my hanger arrived I gained 0,8cm BPEL in 17days. My gains could be the result of my break, higher intensity (from 1kg or less using my extender to 2-3,5kg using my hanger), the angle of my hanging (SO) and amount of rest days (1on - 2off). I believe the results came as a combination of all of these factors, but most of all I believe the 1month break did the trick.

The question is how long should these decon breaks be? 1 month? 2 months? 6 months? For me 1 month seemed to do the job. I am currently on a decon break and it will last 28days. Xenoliths method advices 2months but because of above mentioned results I will try another 1 month decon break.

The risk with cutting these breaks short is lack of gains when one starts over. The risk of taking longer breaks then needed is, well….time wasted?

My best advice to beginners is; keep a log of your PE`efforts, make sure it gives information on method, time (how long do you warm wrap? how long do you hold each stretch? how many jelq strokes? etc) and intensity (weight, tension, how it feels etc.). Also, take starting pictures!

Like I said in the beginning, my gains have been modest, (1,5cm NBPEL in pictures and 0,8cm BPEL in pictures) but I am now able to train smarter. Some might consider it almost rude of me to say that my gains are modest, but what I mean is they are modest considering what they might have been had I known all that I now know. Also, I might be wrong, maybe next cycle will produce 0 gains. (Bet you 50$ I will gain! :) )

Hey Babbis…thanks for your post!

I think that is really the question…isn’t it?

How long should we take to decon properly?

I had the idea that maybe penile elasticity might be a way to determine when to decon and how long.

I thought that one of the characteristics of fibrotic changes is decrease of elasticity…so why not see if this can be used to give us info on when and how long to decondition.

I thought if we make a cheap elasticity meter…something most of us could buy and use.

I thought if we take a digital force meter (like a digital fish scale) and attach it by a few cords to a cable clamp (drill 3-4 holes for the cord).

Put wrap around the glans then attach the clamp (like you’re gonna hang).

Now, preload the penis with a pull of about 3 lbs, then see how much force is needed to stretch the penis another 1/2 inch….and record it.

As the penis toughens, it should cause the force needed to get that 1/2 inch to increase.

I would be interesting to measure elasticity while you start to hang heavier and heavier.

Lets just say as you hang heavier, measure the elasticity, and keep track.

Lets just say before hanging, you get that 1/2 inch with 3 lbs of force. Lets say 6 months later, when gains stop you need 6 lbs to get that same 1/2 inch.

Now you do a decon break and weekly measure your elasticity….I wonder if you would be able to gauge when you are properly deconned by when elasticity returns to your baseline or close to it.

It would be interesting to graph decreasing elasticity vs gains. I’m sure someone like Xeno could extrapolate some great info from this like when elasticity drops below a certain point, gains begin to fall dramatically.

Maybe then we could say when elasticity drops by 50%, time to decon until it returns to 25% above baseline at a minimum.

This is all speculation, but if we could develop some object way to measure when to decon and when you are done…it would really help move this toward a real science.

Originally Posted by real mcdeal
This is not even speculation; merely a single observation.

Approximately 8 months after having stopped hanging (including all other PE related activities, except sex and Kegels), mine still had the conditioned look and feel of veiny, masculine, mostly semi-rigid flaccid; especially morning flaccid was almost always right up with my better PE days FL’s, even after 8 months. Then just the next week, it went back to its pre PE presence and stayed that way. At the time no significant changes otherwise to my generally good physical health; no illness.

I wasn’t thrilled about loosing the PE flaccid. but I was fairily sure it was well and truly back to fresh noob; like nothing had happened, except the extra BPEL/EG. I only jelqed etc for 3 months then hung for 7, never heavier than 15#.

I’ve got nothing else to suggest that a full 8 months would be the optimal decon break in this particular case; just the PI slope was too flat to notice between 0 and 8 months post that active PE period.

rm

Thats scary! 8 months for decon is a big chunk of time!

I really wonder if the full 8 months would be truly needed to restart growth, or it was the time to lose most of your physiologic changes…except size, which sounds like real growth.

Depending on the long haul goal size scheme, I think the optimal decon in this particular case would be somewhere between 0+x months and the full 8 months, x describing the point at which the plateau is broken. Maybe for a 5+ year PE career with a 3” gain goal, throwing in the 8 months would start making some sense.

The indefinite break I went on was partly because I wanted to try out the BPEL I had at the time, then break out the gear again if I wanted more. I was happy right there with good gains.
Admittedly, I was also trudging through a semi-plateau and had trouble with the Bib Regular at higher weights (tapering shaft related problems). The time was right to go after pussy instead of sitting at home at night hoping for another hard gained 1/8”.

Hi all ,

I’m new to the forum but I think I can place my 2 cents here,

I went on all kinds of methods and gained about 2,5cm in Length over 2 years (Ok lets say I did something wrong in the beginning)

Spent the full 2005 doing absolutely nothing

Got back to business this year (02/2005) and got 1 extra cm in 2 months only.

I think resting means something.

Good Luck 4 All! Keep on growing!


Sorry for my english, I´m from Brazil

All life : 12.5cm"

Restarted PE Feb/2006 : 15cm / Today : 18 cm and growing -> this year goal 19cm -> all BPFSL

Originally Posted by ModestoMan

Andrew69 (now A69) never gained from heavy hanging (30# range), but did manage to pack on some gains when he dropped the weight to 15#.

Actually, 15# was as heavy as I hung, and I got zero gains for my effort.

My best (hanging) gains came around 6.75# (with a fulcrum) and totally stalled when I incresed the weight to 8# (again, with a fulcrum)

Ooops! Sorry for mis-remembering that. So you did gain at lower weight. Did I remember correctly that you only gained after dropping back on the weight?


Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Guys, one thing to keep in mind about this force/time business. It’s not the force itself that matters as far as tissue growth is concerned. It’s the stress. There’s a difference.

Force is the tension applied to the penis as a whole, such as the number of pounds you’re hanging. Stress is the tension felt by any particular bit of tissue within the penis. Stress is measured in force per unit area. Depending on how the weight is attached, how the hanger is set up, whether you’re hanging to side, straight out, or using a fulcrum, and even the shape of your penis, the stress on any particular part of the penis will be different—even at the same weight.

This is one reason that talking about pounds isn’t accurate enough to get to the heart of the matter. We really need to talk about the combination of

  1. pounds
  2. hanger settings
  3. hanger attachment
  4. angle
  5. fulcrum
  6. penis shape

Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Sparkyx
I just started a deconditioning break, because I definitely have a toughened tunica. After 2 yrs and only .75eg gain its time to try something else. I was clamping and doing jelqing/girth blasters and recently it seemed that my girth would shrink a little during recovery. My tunica feels like a leather strap under my skin starting about an inch from the base for about 3 inches, which is right above where I clamp. It’s definitely toughened.

So now I’m on a decon break, at least until my cialis comes from india. It usually takes 4 weeks, although I may take a little longer after reading these posts. I really hate decon breaks. I thought I’d just increase intensity and time (using cialis), but now I’m thinking of just increasing time through the longer term cloth strap clamping when I get back into it.

I do have a question. During a decon break would an all day wrap, with an ace bandage around the base interfere or be beneficial? Also, would heat help during the decon break? I mean we do these extra things while peing why not improve the decon break also?

What do you guys think?

(PS. rereading the title of this thread, its a little different from my question so feel free to respond in a different thread or pm me. I don’t want to hijack the thread)

Originally Posted by figaro

I do have a question. During a decon break would an all day wrap, with an ace bandage around the base interfere or be beneficial? Also, would heat help during the decon break? I mean we do these extra things while peing why not improve the decon break also?

What do you guys think?

I think heat wouldn’t hurt, maybe help.

As far as the ace bandage around the base, if you increase the internal pressure, I would think it would slow the deconditioning process.

Its kinda like you go barefoot all summer, and build thick calluses on your feet.

If you go barefoot just a hour a day, it will keep them around much longer than if you always wear shoes.

The more you totally remove the stress that caused the adaptation…the quicker the adaptation will de-adapt.

Originally Posted by ModestoMan

Ooops! Sorry for mis-remembering that. So you did gain at lower weight. Did I remember correctly that you only gained after dropping back on the weight?

Thats correct MM.

I started gaining again after dropping the weight and adding a fulcrum.

Getting gains from hanging was very frustrating for me as I was a very, very easy gainer early on using manual exercises (mostly jelqing)

Thanks Sparky,

I’ll think about that a while and decide when I am sober.

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