Thunder's Place

The big penis and mens' sexual health source, increasing penis size around the world.

Surgical Penis Enlargement Mini Forum ~ Penis surgery

No worries man

Another thing to add is that one can do all the research in the world but the fact’s still surgery so by default there are no guarantees about what will happen to you even if the success rate was 99%, which of course it never is for any method we know

Does anyone know what the difference is between belladerm and alloderm, it has been posted that beladerm is from pigs but thats not true, I went on the belladerm site and it says from humans. The only thing I can tell is it is removed from live bodies instead of dead, but what is the advantage? Any know

Originally Posted by Pau1Pau1
Does anyone know what the difference is between belladerm and alloderm, it has been posted that beladerm is from pigs but thats not true, I went on the belladerm site and it says from humans. The only thing I can tell is it is removed from live bodies instead of dead, but what is the advantage? Any know

I believe the belladerm is thicker. Takes fewer sheets to accomplish the same goal.

Previously banned as stillwantmore, among other aliases.

I think there is more to it than that. I’ve read it’s thicker and more flexible, but I think we need to know how the two products differ in ways other than dimension etc.

Of course the most important thing is how well it’s accepted by the body. The main issue with Alloderm isn’t that it isn’t flexible or thick enough (which it often isn’t on both accounts), but that it gets rejected far too often. I suspect long term we’ll see the same problem with belloderm, as it isn’t made from our own tissue. Ideally we need to know if Belloderm offeres an advantage over Alloderm in terms of complication rates. With any foreign body implant, there will be a certain amount of rejection, encapsulation and reabsorbtion. If belloderm has significant improvement in these areas over Alloderm, then it could be the breakthrough PE surgery has been waiting for. But history has taught me not to be too hopeful over these things.

Copy of my post on MNS

Alloderm is from dead people, belladerm is from live fat people, intexen is from pigs, plga is totally synthetic. They are all biocompatible scaffold matrices

The first three are acellular meaning they have been prepared by removing all original hosts unique cells. All 4 work on the principle that your own tissue, blood supply and cells grows through the scaffolds and the scaffold itself gets reabsorbed into the body.

With plga it biodegrades very quickly max 6 months, with the others it supposedly takes maybe 2 years.

This is in principle, as sometimes the allograft or xenograft may not totally dissolve. You can decide if this is good or bad. I don’t know. But it may also dissolve unevenly

The benefit of belladerm over alloderm with regards to our procedure is that the grafts are said to be slightly thicker than alloderm. It is not a good idea to stack any acellular scaffolds sheets on top of each other as the gap between is totally devoid of any cells or blood supply so would make a good space for festering nasty bacteria, especially as they take years to dissolve and a while for your own cells to grow through. Hence a thicker graft is a better idea than multiple ones to avoid infections.

In my opinion it is probably marketing and the fact that surgeons may buy belladerm for cheaper than alloderm but how would we ever know

The fact that one comes from live people and one comes from dead people makes no difference at all in itself. The end product is the same. Alloderms manufacturer lifecell don’t supply grafts sorted by size but it may be that the alloderm graft that your doctor uses is actually thicker than a belladerm graft that another doctor would have used. There is no real way of knowing. We are talking differences of a mm or 2 anyway

Also the longer a foreign graft is in the body the more time your body would have to grow a fibrous capsule around it as a natural bodily defense mechanism. Rosenthal says he has only seen this in infected patients, Elist says it is a good thing with his silicon implant as it gives more girth, and Gary Alter says this fibrotic tissue is a major problem in the penis as it can induce a pseudo peyronies state

I hope this helps and it would be interesting to hear your views

So what is the conclusion after all this? Is Dr. Elist legit with his silicone implants or is a bad idea to consider surgery with the guy. I spoke to a supposedly patient of his who had the surgery on the phone and said he was 7x6 before the surgery and after is now 8x8. Sounds like B.S.? What do you think fellas? I might just stick to jelqing and pumping. If you call dr. Elist and leave them with your number they will have a supposed patient of theirs call you back and explain their experience. Someone else should do that and let me know your honest opinion. I’m kind of suspicious of his whole site and his forum where people talk of their surgical experience with him. Can anyone post pics or find any of surgery gone bad with this doctor?

Originally Posted by londong
Maybe you could speak to Letizia’s teacher too


You’ll probably be on a hiding to nothing but let us know the score all the same, they may have some honest 5 year (maybe longer) follow never know

I’ve taken a break ans I haven’t read the forum for a while, I’ve also see your messages on another forums.
Since I’m from Italy I know all the doctors you mentioned.
There is a problem with Intexen, in the paper (I don’t remember where I’ve found it) they don’t specify if the use intexen or intexen LP.
There is a huge difference because Intexen LP should not reabsorb in no way, and is mainly used for prolapse, or penis curvature treatment.
Before Intexen the only way to treat curvature was to remove some corpus cavernosa from the other side of the bend (corpoplastica) which caused *always* a length loss, now with Intexen is possible to stretch the bend and preserve the lenght of the penis.
A doctor in Italy call the phalloplasty with intexen incremetal phalloplasty, because within 3/4 months the intexen patch should grow like a sponge.
The good is that intexen is used widely for peyrone disease, pelvic floor prolapse, and other uro-genital disease, the bad is that it’ only 1.5mm thicker
That’s why most doctor call it foil and not patch, because is very very thin, how it can be used for widening the penis it’s a mistery for me.
I’ve heard that doctor Alei did several phalloplasty, nevertheless I’ve also heard that he will only perform the surgery if you really need it, so if you go to him with a penis long 16cm and with a circumference of 12cm, chance are that he will never perform the surgery.

I thought about making a new post on this, but figured I’d post it here.

So I’ve found a pornstar who has clearly had surgery; and it’s actually pretty well done.

His name is Rod Fontana. He’s been in the porn industry for quite sometime. According to rame he’s been making movies since 1993 although in an article he stated that he actually started in the mid 70’s, took a break during the 80’s and came back in the 90’s.

Anyways, if you watch some of his older vids(when he had hair), he is clearly much thinner in girth. His girth is distributed evenly along his penis and the glans to shaft ratio is pretty standard/normal. He essentially has a very normal looking penis.

If you watch more current movies of his(within the last decade), where he is shaved bald and looks a bit older, his penis is much much thicker, especially at the base. His penis now has a very strong conical shape and the glans to shaft ratio is crazy.
It is entirely possible he gained his current size through PE. Although the girth disparity from before/after as well as the conical shape causes me to believe he probably he had surgery.

His erections are quite strong post surgery, and they have a good erection angle. I can’t find any visible scar line from watching and he does shave pretty much all of his pubic hair. There are some scenes I’ve watched where his penis seems slightly more lumpy/pumped looking. His length seems the same, and given his strong upwards erection angle, my assumption is he only had girth work done.

From the looks of it, and taking into account time period, I would assume he had either alloderm or fat injected.


It looks like a cone man.way too freaky

Originally Posted by ThunderSS
Link to porn removed.

It was in the interest of science.

Originally Posted by cecil
Where is all this MNS hate coming from? Do you hate the man? Or his forum? People are being helped there just like they are here. There are hundreds of post op pics - good and bad, with testimonials -at his site - and his site is free. I just don’t get you guys. There are many different docs being discussed there. Does he have a relationship with the Dr. Elis - who corrected his botched job? I don’t know - maybe. The point is the Doc is good - and BTC has alot of good info on many docs - like perovik or mira, and different procedures that Elis doesnt even do. BTC never claimed anyone would gain 4 in over 48 hours. You guys here to hurt or help?

MNS is a sham. I wouldn’t believe much on that site. I to noticed what was going on with all the false statements.

there was a guy patterick who had surgery with the new knife for hire, Dr Knight, had complications and basically had no where to voice his story as his posts kept getting removed. It was claimed that he was “racist”. I dont think anyone cares that Dr Knight is black but they should care that he was caught sleeping with one of his female patients in his surgery room while her kids and huband were waiting out in the car.…ual-misconduct/

I posted this today and it got removed from the sham site mynewsize:

“i think any sane person abhors racism but when you have just been through an ordeal like having grafts come out of your dick and you feel like you are left high and dry by both your surgeon and our forum (which is also used as a support group, not just a medium for promoting doctors), it is obvious that emotions will get the better of anyone and things will get out of hand with regards to language used.

I, for one, am a peace loving guy but i felt suicidal when i though Id lose my dick and felt like killing my surgeon when he blamed me lol let alone simply being rude to him on a forum. After all we all remember the story of how Prof. Austoni in Italy got shot by one of his patients. The support of the gentlemen on this forum helped me through all this.

And i really doubt that a guy who trusts a black person to actually chop into his penis while he is under anaesthetic can be a true racist….do you?

I personally didn’t see any of these racist words at all, especially in the post below, so I guess at least it is OK to post this one (and I respect that MNS had to remove some posts for decorum if they were indeed racist).

Here is the first post I read:

Originally Posted by Patterick - from MNS forums
“hi guys i'm pretty new on the forum here.
i wish i had found it before i had my second procedure.

i made some reply's before to threats, and read other guys experience.

i had a triple augmentation done by dr. knight there where a lot of things that bethored me about the whole thing. i got to him by a company called phallocare owned by dan salas.

the whole thing went bad, i want to tell my experience here, so prevent this from happening to any one else…….

i flew into orange county calafornia, and got picked up by dan salas.
the next day we had the appointment with dr knight.

the consultation was in my own hotel room?…..
then i had a agreement for lenghtning alloderm, and glanular enhancement, before i got there.
then at the consultation they told me they don't use alloderm any more…..
strange the person i mailed with did not mention any of this.
but they use pig skin now. dr knight was pushing that it was better because it was much thicker and you'll get better results.
i had no time to think this over real good because my surgery was the next day.

so i decided to do it, since i was already there.
then the next issue came up, the price was agreed on wasn't correct
they wanted me to pay another 2000 usd because again the person who arrange it made a mistake.
finally i ended up paying a 1000 usd more and getting pig skin instead of alloderm.

so the procedure was lenghtning, thickning, and glanular enhancement.
he ask me what i wanted most? lenght or girth.
i said both, then he laughd and said you can not choose both. hmmmm'
that's stange since i'm paying for both.
so i choose lenght since i was already phat from a previouse alloderm procedure by dr solomon.

but i wanted to be more bigger and do my head of the penis and get more lenght.
dr knight told me that he would put in 4 sheets on the side's and on the top (like a tunnel) and in my head as much ass possible.

so the next day i went to the surgical centre. i thought it was really old it looked like before world war 2.
then im on the table, wake up again, and the nurse guy is pushing me off the table man handling me to put my clothes on, pushing me in a wheel chair and driving me out to dan salas, to bring me back to the hotel

i was still so dizzy from the anastecia my head didn't feel good, i didn't feel good. and i was taken outside.
there was no recovery place or nothing.

then dan picked me up but first we had to drive to get the medications i needed before we could go back to the hotel.

i found out that my penis was wrapped in tape instead of bandages.
i stayd 2 days in bed, then we had to go for a post op visit.
i don't know why dr knight didn't visit me becuase he mentioned he lived around the corner from where i was staying.
and the surgical centre i about 25 min drive.

oke back at the surgical centre me and dan where waiting in a room,
man it smelled in there like there was a dead animal rotting or something dan got this spray from the toilet and began spraying it.

dr knight came in. he cut my tape with scissors. and said look that's nice he
i thoughd hmmm there not much difference in girth. compared to my first surgery i gained a lot more. i told him it isn't much bigger he said can't you see it? you got a quarter inch on both side's
the lenghtning i was happy with i could see a flaccid gain easely.

dr knight's mobile phone went i he accapted the call….
i thought what is he doing? he's busy here with me, and kept talking on the phone longer and longer.
then waved me and dan to go, while being on the phone!!
shit what i felt terrible he didn't give me any results and tips to take care of it. i should have trusted my guts that night in the hotel and shouldn't have worked with these guys. but i wanted it so bad and i was already there.
but if i had the information that they used pig skin i wouldn't even have considerd it.

in the car back i told dan what's his problem, is this normal?
does he always do like this? he said i don't know what he was doing.
like taking the phone call when i was there and dan said yeah he knows i'm
here for you, i will take care of you.

a little later my penis felt burning and it began retracting, dan told me this isn't good. the dr told me to stretch right after surgery, but dan told me not to.
because the incission will pop, that's what i thought also so i waited with it.
so my penis was shorter again. at night i would get erections but it didn't seem longer, even shorter……
2 days later i flew back home

at home my penis stayd small and it began to swell up so much, it would get hard but smaller then i had.
also days went by and at 1 side the scar wouldn't close.
then it started to leak, fluid kept dripping out of that side. i couldnt get in touch with dr knight, so i cantacted dan salas.
he said i think you are having complications. my medications only lasted for a week at home so i went to my personal doctor to get more antibiotics.
dan said i should just stay on antibiotics and it will be ok.
no sound of the doctor yet.

i'm staying at home taking medications at night my penis burns so much im taking every kind of painkiller and sleeping pillsi have but im waking up every 30 minutes.
a week went by my penis is not looking any better, i tried to contact dr knight and dan but i do not get any reply or returnd calls.
then i got a hold of dan and he's asking how i'm doing and i'm telling it's not getting any better. he's saying i'm have complications but not anything how they should take care of this.

then at one night i felt so much pain i was still leaking all the the time.
a really thick hard thing came out of my penis. i have a picture of it.
i was so scarred i was constanly calling them and at last i got a hold of them.
and mailed them the pictures.
dr knight said to be calm and don't worry that it was collogen that by body is making ans it's healing that that is the proces.
and at the worst the grafts could come out and we'll put new ones in.
i didn't feel good and contacted dr solomon my first surgeon he told me that i'm spitting grafts and could take care of me if i wanted but would charge and said, your dr should take care of you.

but he didn't. the next day i wake up and there is this long thing hanging out of the opening i panic again, i hold my penis and this thing came out a long piece of skin, i have pictures how do i upload them.

i'm constandly calling the dr every where mobile at his office, then at the surgical centre, then i got a hold of him and told him what happend.
he starts to scream at me how did this happen why the graft came out?
not so strange i think my body is already leaking 2 weeks little pieces of withe stuff were already coming out all the time and it hurts like hell.
i said you got to help me now i'm having problems, i said i'm coming back i need new surgery.
he said no if you come back now i will not perform any surgery on you or i will take out all grafts.
i thought shit what an asshole. fuck him. i booked a flight for the next morning
i missed it.
at the airport i went to the restroom, and in my sheets there was another graft. i lost 2 now.
i rebooked my flight for the next day. the next day a flew back to california.

but in the time i camed there my penis was getting better it looked like my body wanted these grafts out and it did.

when i arrived there dan picked me uo again from the airport i asked him what the hell is going on and why no one is taking any action and why the doctor acting like a jerk. he says he doesnt know. but now my infection now already cleared up.

the next they we're going to his office, he wants to talk to dan first then comes to me. and checkes my penis he said you came all this way for this.
yes now it is ok but it wasn't before.
i asked him what about the grafts i lost he said he can put new ones in but i will have to pay for them.
i thought shit that's not right… but i was so tired from my 16 hour flight and dan promised me he would take care of me and he will pay for the procedure.
the doctor attitude changed completly when i was there he didn't make any eye contact he felt a shamed about how he acted.
and after he told dan i wasn't raising my voice to him dan on the phone i promissed, yes of course i dreamed all of this.
my mind now was on healing first then see what happens.

ok my scar closed within 2 weeks i got home. but there are more problems now my dick shrunk an inch erect! i feel terrible i lost grafts lenght… shit.
and dr knight is charging me money for another procedure to fix things.

dan is saying he will pay that he doesn't run his company like this and the doctor still acts like an ass.

i decided now that i don't want surgery from him again that he can keep all of his excuses, and i'm asking dan to pay like he said for my procedure with another surgeon.
i don't get any response and hear nothing from them. so i willpay for my self but i want everyone to know how they threat people.

how do i upload picture's and where can i tell my experience more to prevent them from making false promises and not helping you when you have problems

they ruined everything for me my relationship everything, and don't follow up on there promisses and only care about money.
this all from dan salas and this cocky surgeon dr. knight with his ferrari, clk convertable, and a range rover sport.

i forgot to mention that now when i'm healing and i don't have any more water inside.
i can tell that i only have grafts put in on the sides, and not at the top that he promissed me so my girth isn't much thicker.
also on the phone he said you lost 2 grafts so you still have 1 in there…
so he gave me 3 instead of 4.
i can feel where they are because the feel hard my body still needs to absorp them.
they only thing that chaned was me wallet. and i still need to get it fix.

very nice these guys

it had pictures to accompany it but i dont have them

now even if the above story is one-sided, and the doc has a good explanation (yes, the preferred choice of any surgeon’s patient blame reasons is the “he had sex too early” one) it is still good form to at least read it so other patients considering surgery have a rounded view of what COULD happen.

I did not post this to attack Dr Knight, just so that we are all fully informed and can make our own minds up.”

Wow. I finally read this entire thread. Surgery is fucking crazy.

Originally Posted by Praseo
Wow. I finally read this entire thread. Surgery is fucking crazy.

damn right


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