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Surgical Penis Enlargement Mini Forum ~ Penis surgery

Originally Posted by joey999
So how do either you or 8Ball explain what is happening on MNS regarding Elist. I’m not saying he’s refering patients to Elist, but that he does have some sort of business relationship with Elist. You are clearly familiar with the site and know how BTC oppeartes, so surely you can see the incredible similairtes between the sudden mass of EList posters and those past Krakovsky posters. Obvioulsy you’ve been told otherwise, but answer these questions:

1.) Why on earth would BTC go to such lengths to protect Dr Elist? He was the first person to PM and ask for the photo’s (having not posted for weeks previously) and once the photo’s were posted on the forum he took them down giving a most bizarre reason. He claimed he was investigating the validity of the patients case and if they proved to be real he’d re-up them (I know for a fact they were real and knew the patient was having the surgery, as did other members of this site). Dr Elist himself confirmed to another poster at MNS (Azdutch) that the story was true, but BTC didn’t re up the photo’s. Instead he deleted the investigation thread and banned posters who asked questions. Now serioulsy why would anyone do that if they weren’t trying to protect the Dr concerned?

2.) Why have so many of these Elist “patients” got old accounts, but no posting history? Are we suppossed to believe they’ve been lurking all this time and have suddenly come out of the wood work? Why did none of them mention Elist before?

3.) Don’t you think it’s an absurdly massive coincidence that when Elist’s name first started being mentioned on forums, a poster at the yahoo group said BTC had told him that he was working with Elist and that since then MNS has become inundated with Elist patients? I asked BTC about this and he said he didn’t get along with that poster (Jeffrey Hall) and he’s made it up. But why would he make it up? He couldn’t possibly have seen into the future and known BTC’s website was suddenly going to inundated with Elist patients!

Obvioulsy you have repsect for Dr Elist and don’t believe he could be involved with BTC, so maybe it would be a good idea for some neutral posters from this thread to chime in and say what they think based on the points i’ve made. Could it be one huge (and it would have to be ridiculously huge) coincidence that all these things have happened or is it more than likley BTC stands to gain from promoting Dr Elist?

Oh and one final point. Knowing BTC’s history, why on earth would he waste his time moderating a forum if had nothing to gain from it? Surley this point alone should be enough to convince you. No atter how much you were convinced or perhaps don’t want to belive Dr Elist is involved with BTC, can you really imagine BTC doing something for nothing? Why would he go the effort of selling the forum and still spend time working on it? You have to ad it that makes no sense at all.


Bro, I’m not here defending Chad, I don’t know the answer to all of your questions, nor do I claim to. I’m just stating the stuff I know to be fact and leaving any opinions of mine out of the picture so the reader can form their own.


"If you can conceive it, and you can believe it...then you can achieve it."

Formerly known as Gandolf

Thanks to everyone for keeping it civil. :up: I’m sure this discussion will benefit someone who is contemplating surgery, whatever opinion they may form from the info here.

Originally Posted by 8-Ball
Bro, I’m not here defending Chad, I don’t know the answer to all of your questions, nor do I claim to. I’m just stating the stuff I know to be fact and leaving any opinions of mine out of the picture so the reader can form their own.

I didn’t mean to seem to be having a pop at either you or thethickone, it’s just that, like you, I’ve had a botched surgery myself and it really screwed my life up for a long time. Therefore I find some of what goes on in the PE surgey business hard to stomach. I’d hate for anyone to have to go through what i’ve had to as a result of my surgery. Yet certain people in this industry seem as if they couldn’t care less, as long as they get paid. I’m not anti Dr Elist even and I’ve heard he’s done some very good reconstructive work. But I’d be seriously cautious about his silicone implant and don’t like the way more and more people are being seduced into having it over on MNS. There are good reasons why every other PE surgeon I know of is seriously against the use of solid silicone. They don’t go to the effort of using dermal grafts or expensive implant material like Alloderm, when they could use the most popular implant material in the world (silicone) without good reason. Anyone who thinks Dr Elist is the only Dr who has thought of using strips of silicone is totally deluded. PE surgery has been around for decades and so has silicone and I can assure everyone it would have been the first implant material they thought of and the first they rejected. Foreign body material and the penis don’t mix well. As far as I know no one has ever posted an erect post op photo of an Elist implant and no results have been published in any medical journal (despite him claiming he’s been doing it since 2002). Yet over on MNS this surgery is being treated like it’s solution we’ve all been waiting for and male equivalent of the boob job has arrived.

Originally Posted by joey999

I didn’t mean to seem to be having a pop at either you or thethickone, it’s just that, like you, I’ve had a botched surgery myself and it really screwed my life up for a long time. Therefore I find some of what goes on in the PE surgey business hard to stomach. I’d hate for anyone to have to go through what i’ve had to as a result of my surgery. Yet certain people in this industry seem as if they couldn’t care less, as long as they get paid. I’m not anti Dr Elist even and I’ve heard he’s done some very good reconstructive work. But I’d be seriously cautious about his silicone implant and don’t like the way more and more people are being seduced into having it over on MNS. There are good reasons why every other PE surgeon I know of is seriously against the use of solid silicone. They don’t go to the effort of using dermal grafts or expensive implant material like Alloderm, when they could use the most popular implant material in the world (silicone) without good reason. Anyone who thinks Dr Elist is the only Dr who has thought of using strips of silicone is totally deluded. PE surgery has been around for decades and so has silicone and I can assure everyone it would have been the first implant material they thought of and the first they rejected. Foreign body material and the penis don’t mix well. As far as I know no one has ever posted an erect post op photo of an Elist implant and no results have been published in any medical journal (despite him claiming he’s been doing it since 2002). Yet over on MNS this surgery is being treated like it’s solution we’ve all been waiting for and male equivalent of the boob job has arrived.

I hear you man. I, too, don’t like the cut throat nature of the PE business for obvious reasons. I ruled out using Dr. Elist for my own surgery based on nothing more than a gut feeling when I spoke to him. I went against my gut with Rheinschild because he told me everything I wanted to hear and I promised myself I wouldn’t do it again. When I spoke with Elist, he was extremely evasive with me when I asked him some BASIC questions about the grafts and the surgical technique he uses. When I made several attempts to clarify what he was saying he got extremely defensive and downright shitty with me. It’s very possible that he’s a fine surgeon but just based on my feeling from that one phone call I knew I would never go to him and for that reason I’ve barely glanced over all the Elist threads over at MNS. I don’t want to read someone’s “glowing recommendation” and get tempted to go through with a surgery that I don’t trust in my heart.


"If you can conceive it, and you can believe it...then you can achieve it."

Formerly known as Gandolf

Originally Posted by joey999
So how do either you or 8Ball explain what is happening on MNS regarding Elist. I’m not saying he’s refering patients to Elist, but that he does have some sort of business relationship with Elist. You are clearly familiar with the site and know how BTC oppeartes, so surely you can see the incredible similairtes between the sudden mass of EList posters and those past Krakovsky posters. Obvioulsy you’ve been told otherwise, but answer these questions:

1.) Why on earth would BTC go to such lengths to protect Dr Elist? He was the first person to PM and ask for the photo’s (having not posted for weeks previously) and once the photo’s were posted on the forum he took them down giving a most bizarre reason. He claimed he was investigating the validity of the patients case and if they proved to be real he’d re-up them (I know for a fact they were real and knew the patient was having the surgery, as did other members of this site). Dr Elist himself confirmed to another poster at MNS (Azdutch) that the story was true, but BTC didn’t re up the photo’s. Instead he deleted the investigation thread and banned posters who asked questions. Now serioulsy why would anyone do that if they weren’t trying to protect the Dr concerned?

2.) Why have so many of these Elist “patients” got old accounts, but no posting history? Are we suppossed to believe they’ve been lurking all this time and have suddenly come out of the wood work? Why did none of them mention Elist before?

3.) Don’t you think it’s an absurdly massive coincidence that when Elist’s name first started being mentioned on forums, a poster at the yahoo group said BTC had told him that he was working with Elist and that since then MNS has become inundated with Elist patients? I asked BTC about this and he said he didn’t get along with that poster (Jeffrey Hall) and he’s made it up. But why would he make it up? He couldn’t possibly have seen into the future and known BTC’s website was suddenly going to inundated with Elist patients!

Obvioulsy you have repsect for Dr Elist and don’t believe he could be involved with BTC, so maybe it would be a good idea for some neutral posters from this thread to chime in and say what they think based on the points i’ve made. Could it be one huge (and it would have to be ridiculously huge) coincidence that all these things have happened or is it more than likley BTC stands to gain from promoting Dr Elist?

Oh and one final point. Knowing BTC’s history, why on earth would he waste his time moderating a forum if had nothing to gain from it? Surley this point alone should be enough to convince you. No atter how much you were convinced or perhaps don’t want to belive Dr Elist is involved with BTC, can you really imagine BTC doing something for nothing? Why would he go the effort of selling the forum and still spend time working on it? You have to ad it that makes no sense at all.

I just checked out the site and you’re right he has suddenly manufactured a ton of new Dr. E threads.

I feel for the little hobbit. Dude has some issues.

I think what people are trying to say, well at least I am is;

1.) When I first posted Dr. E had no business relationship with Chad

2.) Seeing the website it appears Chad is setting up Dr. E for some quid-pro-quo nonsense

3.) If Dr. E knew how much of a scammer Chad was he’d not have anything to do with him.

4.) Dr. E is a great surgeon with a solid reputation and has been doing these types of surgeries for YEARS before Chad even had his first surgery.

If I had to hazard I guess I’d say Chad is trying to sucker Dr. E into a business relationship and if he does it will soon fizzle because Chad just can’t seem to deal straight with people. The Little Hobbit doesn’t want to treat people fairly.

Originally Posted by joey999
I didn’t mean to seem to be having a pop at either you or thethickone, it’s just that, like you, I’ve had a botched surgery myself and it really screwed my life up for a long time. Therefore I find some of what goes on in the PE surgey business hard to stomach. I’d hate for anyone to have to go through what i’ve had to as a result of my surgery. Yet certain people in this industry seem as if they couldn’t care less, as long as they get paid. I’m not anti Dr Elist even and I’ve heard he’s done some very good reconstructive work. But I’d be seriously cautious about his silicone implant and don’t like the way more and more people are being seduced into having it over on MNS. There are good reasons why every other PE surgeon I know of is seriously against the use of solid silicone. They don’t go to the effort of using dermal grafts or expensive implant material like Alloderm, when they could use the most popular implant material in the world (silicone) without good reason. Anyone who thinks Dr Elist is the only Dr who has thought of using strips of silicone is totally deluded. PE surgery has been around for decades and so has silicone and I can assure everyone it would have been the first implant material they thought of and the first they rejected. Foreign body material and the penis don’t mix well. As far as I know no one has ever posted an erect post op photo of an Elist implant and no results have been published in any medical journal (despite him claiming he’s been doing it since 2002). Yet over on MNS this surgery is being treated like it’s solution we’ve all been waiting for and male equivalent of the boob job has arrived.

I understand how you feel. I understand 100%. That’s why Chad pisses me off. He’s hurt a lot of people and Karma smoked his butt for it.
Reap what you sow is a universal truth that can’t be denied.

As to your comments on Alloderm I can say the stuff is not good for PE. I would not recommend it. I think we’ll have to agree to disagree on the silicone.
Silicone oil injection is used for complicated retinal detachment surgery. Silicone has been used successfully for metacarpophalangeal joint prosthesis.

Silicone is used for bone implants, coatings for pace makers, drain tubes for surgeries, and replacement lens within the eye.
Silicone implants have been successfully used for calf muscles, chest muscles, facial bones, penis, testicles, nose, and ears since 1962.
Today doctors use silicone to create the “Lapband” for stomach surgeries for morbid obese people.
Silicone has also been used to make implants for craniofacial defects

Heck some women even get butt implants made from silicone.

You also seem to just assume silicone was used in phalloplasty and then rejected, but I’ve never read that study. If you have the link I’d like to see it.

In any event I feel for you about your surgery and that’s the very reason why I say what I feel about the Hobbit a.k.a Chad.

Well I don’t think any doctor can ever do 100% “successful” surgeries. The anatomy, the patients keeping proper post-op protocols. Those of us who’ve had the surgeries can point to lots of people who had success.

The issue is society doesn’t allow the research that’s needed. Breast implants are celebrated a man with a small penis looking to have surgery is told to “deal with it”, “get help”, “size doesn’t matter”, and so on and then society turns around and glorifies the man with the massive Johnson.

Surgery works, but everything has to fall in line and you may need more than one. I know too many success stories to think otherwise

Why do the hot docs fall out of favor after awhile then? It’s like a fucking Book of the Month club. I’m thinking you guys talk yourself into these different docs, then the bad news sends you seeking another savior.

You won’t catch me celebrating breast implants.


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Originally Posted by thethickone
.

If I had to hazard I guess I’d say Chad is trying to sucker Dr. E into a business relationship and if he does it will soon fizzle because Chad just can’t seem to deal straight with people. The Little Hobbit doesn’t want to treat people fairly.

As of a couple of weeks ago it’s been pretty much confirmed that they are in business together. There is now a thread MNS stating that MNS members are to recieve a “discount” from Dr Elist. That to me removed any last doubts. Previously it was difficult to work out how Chad would gain financially from the relationship and I had suggested it was a sponsorship deal, but now thanks to the “discount” Dr Elist can be sure of exaclty which patients have been put his way thanks to Chad.

I understand what you say about the use of silicone in other forms of surgery, but the penis is a dynamic organ. I assure you that it would have been the first implant material considered when surgeons first tried to enlarge the penis. I’m sure dr Elist is a good surgeon, but I’d be interested to hear what he has to say about his success rate when he trialled the implant in Serbia 7 years ago. I don’t want to mention him by name but one of the two famous Serbian PE surgeons told me personally that they had to remove 23 of the 24 implants. Also this isn’t even the first time Dr Elist has tried to use a silicone implant. He previously had a patent for a silicone implant in 1994, but stopped using it and reverted back to FFT. Another surgeon I spoke to described the implant technique as a time bomb. It’s not the first weeks after surgery patients need to worry about, but several years down the line. Even with successful silicone implant surgery it is normal for scar tissue to build up around the implant. In the case of boob jobs etc, this isn’t the end of the world, but a penis is very different. It sounds that you have a lot of respect for Dr Elist and I’m sure it’s with good reason, but surely you can’t believe that Dr Elsit was the first Dr to think of using silicone implants? And the design itself is hardly rocket science. Are you not suspicious as to why Dr Elist is the only surgeon using this incredibly obvious solution to penis enlargement?

About scar tissue building up around implants, about 20 years ago - maybe more recently - breast implants were “slick” and the scar tissue would form around them and harden. A friend of a friend had a boob job done, and I was told she had to massage her boobs every day to keep the tissue from forming so fast.

Then I read that the “new generation” fun bags came with a rough surface, so that the tissue had something to “grip” - thus the scar tissue didn’t “feel the need” to from all around, harder and harder, as with a slick surface.

If I’ve understood this correctly, maybe silicone implants with a similarly “rough” surface would do fine?


regards, mgus

Taped onto the dashboard of a car at a junkyard, I once found the following: "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." The car was crashed.

Primary goal: To have an EQ above average (i.e. streetsmart, compassionate about life and happy) Secondary goal: to make an anagram of my signature denoting how I feel about my gains

Originally Posted by ThunderSS
Why do the hot docs fall out of favor after awhile then? It’s like a fucking Book of the Month club. I’m thinking you guys talk yourself into these different docs, then the bad news sends you seeking another savior.

You won’t catch me celebrating breast implants.

If you think that about me you’re wrong I’ve only ever been to one doctor in my life. You’re just assuming things. As to hot docs falling out of favor. I’ve not advocated one doctor after another and don’t know what you’re referring to.

I like Dr. Wineland, but he only does length. I think Dr. Guinta is a good doctor. Dr Rheinschild is too old. I never advocated Dr. K. and I’ve had two friends go to Dr. E with excellent results.

You need to understand that phalloplasty is a unique field. What happens is “different” people choose different Doc’s and if they have good results then people discuss them.

I personally know 9 guys who had surgery. 2 had major issues, 6 had great results, one it’s too early to tell. 5 different doctors did the surgeries. Based on what I’ve seen I’d choose 2 of those doctors for girth and another for length because he uses different technique. The other 2 I’d run from as fast as possible

Each doctor has his own method and each method has it’s pros and cons. It’s up to the individual to decide which technique is best for them

I wasn’t singling you out tto. That’s the general picture that I seem to find with this surgery stuff. Of course I am assuming and I don’t really care to spend the time to back up my assumption. But you can bet your sweet ass that I would if I were going under the knife.


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Originally Posted by ThunderSS
I wasn’t singling you out tto. That’s the general picture that I seem to find with this surgery stuff. Of course I am assuming and I don’t really care to spend the time to back up my assumption. But you can bet your sweet ass that I would if I were going under the knife.

No problem and I understand. I also would do my homework if I have another surgery.

Have a good night.

Originally Posted by thethickone
I understand how you feel. I understand 100%. That’s why Chad pisses me off. He’s hurt a lot of people and Karma smoked his butt for it.
Reap what you sow is a universal truth that can’t be denied.

As to your comments on Alloderm I can say the stuff is not good for PE. I would not recommend it. I think we’ll have to agree to disagree on the silicone.
Silicone oil injection is used for complicated retinal detachment surgery. Silicone has been used successfully for metacarpophalangeal joint prosthesis.

Silicone is used for bone implants, coatings for pace makers, drain tubes for surgeries, and replacement lens within the eye.
Silicone implants have been successfully used for calf muscles, chest muscles, facial bones, penis, testicles, nose, and ears since 1962.
Today doctors use silicone to create the “Lapband” for stomach surgeries for morbid obese people.
Silicone has also been used to make implants for craniofacial defects

Heck some women even get butt implants made from silicone.

You also seem to just assume silicone was used in phalloplasty and then rejected, but I’ve never read that study. If you have the link I’d like to see it.

In any event I feel for you about your surgery and that’s the very reason why I say what I feel about the Hobbit a.k.a Chad.

Http://www.nature.com/ijir/journal/…l/3901217a.html

Take a look at this one. It’s an interesting read.


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