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quik4life's $500 PE Challenge

Originally Posted by quik4life
Can you explain in more detail your routine when you had the “most dramatic gains.” What erection percentage were you jelqing at? Did you warm up and warm down, or did you just jelq in the shower? Did you stretch before, during or after you jelqed?

I would use a hot washcloth for 5 minutes then do 5 or 6 one minute stretches. I’d warm up again with the washcloth and then try to jelq at about 80% but maintaining that wasn’t easy. Maintaining a consistent 80% erection level was a balancing act between thinking about work when I was too hard and thinking about sex when I wasn’t hard enough. Some times it would take a minute to get back to the right level and I would factor that lost minute into the total length of my routine.

Actually the 80% figure is an estimate; the way that I would gauge what I thought was a good level was at the beginning of my jelq session I would do a couple of strokes and see if my glans looked like it had the texture of an orange peel. If my head wasn’t engorged enough to get the orange peel look I would try to get it a bit harder and then try to maintain that level just by feel, but never what I would consider a full erection. After a few minutes my glans would smooth out which is why I would look at the texture at the beginning of my session. I kegel at the end of one stroke and grab the base with the other hand before releasing the pressure of the first stroke.

That seemed to work for me. Hope it helps.

Originally Posted by quik4life

Pud, how long has it been since you last masturbated? How much gains can you attribute to this routine? Also, can you give me a specific routine to follow (if I choose), including when (morning, night) and how (wet, dry and what erection percentage) to jelq, when and how to stretch, should I warm up, down, etc.? Basically, all the details.

Pud, you really got me thinking. I’ve been re-reading and re-reading sparkyx’s PI threads and I think this all ties in. Thanks for your post. I look forward to your reply.

EDIT: Didn’t see that you posted a sample routine. Can you provide a bit more details? Like, what erection percentage, should I warm up and down? Also, it seems that you ejaculate every day off. So, you basically jelq for two days and ejaculate on your rest day, then repeat. Right?


I stopped masturbating about a month ago. I started this exact routine at that same time with all these ideas as the main reason. I haven’t measured for girth since I started, but I have gained for sure. The wife keeps telling me it feels huge, every time we have sex these past few weeks. I’m not making huge gain claims, I have techniques for making my unit engorged with only a few minutes of fluff right before sex. I cock ring a semi erection about 60% and do hard kegels into obends for about five minutes. I do this right before sex, find some excuse to go to the bathroom. I get my girth up considerably doing this, and it stays for the duration of the sex.

I was at 5.0 girth when I started, now I cant fit into a toilet paper roll even partly erect. In fact after my routine in the morning I cant fit my flaccid unit in the toilet paper roll. I’m talking completely soft. But I have a much bigger head than shaft, and I have a jelq stretch that I’ve been doing that is awesome. I do my 12 minutes of jelqing, then I do a few jelq stretches which consist of getting about 75% erection with the overhand jelq I jelq down once to make sure I’m clear of any veins, then I jelq down and hold into a stretch. I feel a good lig stretch from this, I also feel this might help increase the head size because it is very intense, newbies beware. Women love big heads, just so you know. Or at least my wife does…

Like I said I do the overhand dry jelq with a cock ring on, use a time limit, jelq no more than 15 minutes a day, 2 days on one off. Stopped masturbating all together.

If your single and don’t ever have sex you should try to stop masturbating anyway. This act alone will get you a girlfriend, I’ll bet money. It will come out, it will come out in your dreams. What wonderful dreams you have when you don’t masturbate. I swear I’m going to write a book on how wonderful life is without masturbating. But if you absolutely can’t have sex for whatever reason, you should limit masturbating to once a week, or just doing it on the night before your off day which is every three days. But you should shoot for getting relief from your dreams. I have tits and ass dreams that are just wonderful. I picked up a hot blond with huge tits and a white tee shirt that you could see through the other night. The best thing about dreams is you don’t know they aren’t real. Until you wake up that is.


In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

Damn I keep posting but not getting to the point! I’ve turned into a rambler.

I use to use a heat pad for warming up. Now I have a huge cup I keep near my bathroom sink. I splash hot water on the unit until I get it to a good temperature then I fill the cup up and pour. I do this over and over with kegels, stretches, until I feel I’m sufficiently warmed up, and sporting a engorged erection that is prime for expanding. I spend about 5 or 8 minutes doing this.

I jelq at high erection levels, I jelq very slowly, I don’t count, I jelq for expansion not numbers. I jelq with a cock ring on as well, this helps with expansion.


In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

Pud -

Do you have sex with a cock ring on (rubber-like O ring type)…. yes or no??

Quik4life, earlier in this thread you mentioned that it wouldn’t take much enlargement to make your penis to seem very large in proportion to your body; I have the opposite problem, I’m a body builder and have been for years so I have a 250lb(x6% fat) build and it makes me feel like my penis would have to be massive to be large in proportion to my body

Quik, hang, and do horse 440’s. I’m sorry to say, I think clamping probably wouldn’t work for you yet, because your girth is too low for the clamp to create much pressure, but a clamp can’t compare to your own fingers squeezing, and when you squeeze the head at the same time.. Well, it’s intense.

quik4life, has it occured to you that maybe you’re doing too much? Maybe you’re too dedicated? If I were you, I’d give myself a decon. break of around 2 months, and then start on a relaxed newbie routine with double the amont of warm-ups. If that doesn’t work, keep adding to the Newbie Routine slowly until you find something that works.


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I’m far from a vet or a big gainer but I’ve been doing reading, definitely check out Xenoliths log in the personal routines forum it’s long but somewhere in there he has his “IPR” routine, he’s made great gains and it seems to be the most scientifically designed routine I’ve seen yet. Also check out the log of Babbis, he used Xenos routine after not gaining anything for 6 months and he gained 0.8cm in something like 14 days. You might want to do a 2 month decon break then get into his routine with hanging and an ADS

Screw it. Here, taken straight from Xenos log:

Quote
Several members have asked me about my PE training strategy. I’ve replied with varying degrees of specificity. Here are my thoughts on the subject with more specificity. Realize however, that nonetheless, the following represents a highly abbreviated, without references, details of my experiments and results, evolution of thought, specific training techniques, etc. Version of my PE training strategy. It’s based on the IPR Theory of repair (http://www.electrotherapy.org/elect.ling/tissue.htm) for connective (I.e. Contractive) tissues in (as much as possible) the non-contracted state. Much of my thinking and understanding of this material has been influenced by discussion with or posts by MX and Shiver. Much thanks guys.

There are several additional concepts that have relevance to this method that I’ll either only briefly mention or not mention at all in this discussion, among them are: Fibonacci number sequence systematics, fractal theory, calculus, Static Progressive Stretch, facial plasticity, oscillatory feedback cyclicity, collagen speciation and fibrosis that have gone into my thinking, experiment and training designs, the outcomes of which have resulted in the formulation of this multi-scale IPR PE training protocol system. I encourage the inquisitive reader seek more information on these subjects than I will present here.

IPR Theory based PE training protocol:

Inflammation, Proliferation, Remodeling. All three phases are equally important. Although in the conventional context of IPR Theory, a single injury occurs and then goes through this cycle over the course of many months, in my experience, the concept can be applied in the context of PE effectively at (at least two) different temporal scales: micro-scale (2-3 day cycle) and macro-scale (2-3 months) protocols, during which, the I and P phases are manipulated to a high degree.

Inflammation: can presumably be done with any of the conventional PE training methods: hanging, stretching, jelqing, clamping, pumping. I’ve used it successfully with hanging, jelqing and clamping. The goal is to cause tissue strain in the direction of desired growth. In my experience, which admittedly has been largely length focused, IPR concepts have appeared to be somewhat more conducive to length growth than girth growth, but I use IPR protocols irrespective of the type of gains I’m seeking and have had it work well for girth focused gains campaigns also. For the most part, I’ve employed hanging coupled with wet jelqing as my general IPR based training. In that context, I’ve focused much of my attention on how to most effectively and safely inflame my penile tissues. At this point, I think moderate weight hanging is the most effective and safest means. What constitutes “moderate” will depend on the conditioning level of your tissues.

Proliferation: is done with the aid of an ADS device in the case of length focused work or a cock ring, Thera-P wristband, etc. In the case of girth focused work. The goal of the P phase is to keep the tissues that were strained during the I phase aligned in as close as possible to the same direction that the I phase stressor was aligned. This facilitates cellular growth (mitosis) along the same vectors (of initial strain) by means of distraction histogenesis, a term which basically means preferentially directed mitosis. Therefore, in the case of ADS wearing, one should orient it in the as close to the direction of their I phase stressor as possible.

Remodeling: is rest. Simple. Leave it alone.

Micro-scale IPR: Inflame in the morning (for instance). Proliferate, micro-P phase, with ADS for support of length focused training, or with a cock ring, Thera-P wristband, etc., for support of girth focused training, for the rest of the day. Remodeling, micro-R phase begins at the end of the training day, at which point I rest my tissues for either 36 hrs (overnight + 1 full day) or 60 hrs (overnight + 2 full days). Repeat. Of course, training methods other than hanging can be used.

Macro-scale IPR: can be done in or out of the context of micro-scale IPR. When done in the context of micro-scale IPR, one considers all of their micro-scale work to be the I phase of their macro-scale IPR training, and therefore terminates their micro-scale training cycle after ~2 weeks and initiates the macro-scale P phase, which initially consists of ADS or cock ring use for as much of every day as possible and tapers down in daily usage until an additional 4 weeks of time has elapsed. At which point the macro-scale P phase is terminated and the macro-scale R phase is initiated, with rest for at least 2 months.

In formulating the magnitude of “work”, where work = frequency x volume (or load), of my training within individual gains campaigns, I consider the form of my “characteristic (gains) function”, which is to say, I fit a trendline to my (typically length, although I’ve used girth and volume as well) gains vs. Time curve and then, in accordance with concepts described by Fibonacci number sequence theory, I plot the inverse of the reciprocal of that curve, which I then scale to a 3 week time interval, the interval that I’ve empirically determined yields the greatest positive feedback/least negative feedback, and, is consistent with concepts described by IPR tissue healing systematics. By solving for the nth derivative of the nth degree polynomial that defines the work vs. Time curve explicitly for the day being considered, one can determine the theoretical optimum work amount for that day.

Of course the scales of the characteristic gains function and the work function are different, but, as described by fractal theory, the shapes can be thought to be manifestations of each other, and therefore, in accordance with cybernetic biofeedback concepts, the use of the (scaled to IPR appropriate scale version of the) inverse of the reciprocal (or, if you prefer, inverse of the mirror image) of the characteristic curve, is well justified. Indeed, when the individual gains campaign curve is plotted on the same axes as the work curve, they almost always form a closed loop, which serves to confirm the veracity and applicability of the method.

In all of my modeling, the point of maximum inflection of the work vs. Time curve is located very near the 14 day mark (actually, it’s almost always at day 12) as is ultimately, of course, defined by the point of maximum inflection of my characteristic gains curve. Therefore, in practice, I generally consider the ~2 week point to be the point where my body’s physiology is beginning to most significantly change from one of positive feedback (I.e. Gains) to one of negative feedback (I.e. Conditioning, which is really a whole other subject that demands consideration of collagen speciation and fibrosis systematics, but the characteristic gains function incorporates these). As such, it’s at ~ 2 weeks that I should stop my I phase work. Experience has shown that I typically achieve ~ 75% of the possible gains that I can make in any given gains campaign within the first 2 weeks. Use of a millimeter scale/ruler is a good idea). Sympathetically, it would follow that ~ 25% of the possible conditioning has occurred to that point as well. As such, 2 weeks has shown itself to be something of a break point, beyond which one’s return on investment falls precipitously. Also, as predicted by Fibonacci number theory, one can reasonably expect that the “take off point” with respect to conditioning, of each succeeding gains campaign will be incrementally greater than that of the one before. By pursuing the “expensive” last ~25% of gains, we are deflecting up in conditioning space the “landing point” of our current gains campaign as well as deflecting into higher conditioning space the “take off point” of our subsequent gains campaign. Therefore, IMO, it’s foolish to chase that last 25% of available gains at the expense of 75% of the available conditioning. Beyond the fact that doing so buys you less and less gains with more and more investment, it also raises the cost of your next “cheap” gains in our next gains campaign.

To do this method rigorously requires that one identify their characteristic gains function, which requires that one has kept track of their gains as a function of time and can plot them. If that can be done, one need not use calculus, one can simply superimpose the two plots graphically, and then re-label the ordinate (y-axis) in simple dimensionless integer units (1,2,3) which represent work multiplier coefficients, by which the starting value of work will be multiplied during the course of the gains campaign. In my experience of solving for work multiplier coefficients quantitatively, the 2 week point typically plots at a work multiplier coefficient of ~1.5, with the 3 week point typically correlating to a work multiplier coefficient of ~2.5.

One can multiply their PE work by increasing frequency and/or load. In the simplest case of jelqing, it makes most sense to simply increase the frequency, which in this context means # of jelq strokes, not duration of time between jelq strokes or duration of time between sessions. I’ll get to a discussion of the latter of these types of frequency in a moment. So what this means is that on day 1 of gains campaign A, one does, say X1 jelqs, then wears ADS for the rest of the day, then rests for the next 2 days and then on day 4, does X1 x (day 4 work multiplier coefficient) jelqs (call it X2), wears ADS for the rest of the day, then rests for the next 2 days and then on day 7, does X2 x (day 7 work multiplier coefficient) jelqs (call it X3), etc, until day 13, upon which (unless one can’t fight the urge to go after those “expensive” 25% gains), one transitions to macro P phase work and wears ADS for ~4weeks, transitioning (linearly) over this time from high wearing time (P-phase) to high not wearing time (R-phase), ultimately transitioning to pure rest (R-phase) after the 4th week of ADS wearing and continues with pure rest for 2 months before initiating gains campaign B. 3 months is recommended in the case of having pushed one’s I-phase work into a third week. Which in and of itself is a good reason to not push one’s gains campaigns into a third week, not to mention those that I’ve mentioned already.

For this (low erection, I.e. Length targeting) jelqing example we’ll start with, say 200 jelqs and a work multiplier coefficient of 1.1, which when coupled with a 1 day, 2 days off session frequency to approximate what looks like the “sweetspot” of work progression for the first 2 weeks. So, the first 2 weeks of our example would look like this:

Day 1: 200 jelqs, Day 4: 200 x 1.1 = 220 jelqs, Day 7: 220 jelqs x 1.1 = 242 jelqs, Day 10: 242 jelqs x 1.1 = 266 jelqs, Day 13: 266 jelqs x 1.1 = 293 jelqs.

Notice that at the ~2 week point, our work has increased relative to our starting point, by a factor of ~ 1.5. Because this corresponds well with the work multiplier coefficients that I’ve calculated for and solved for graphically, I think a work multiplier coefficient of 1.1 in the context of a 1 day on/2 days off session frequency is about the sweetspot for the IPR protocol (as based on MY physiological response systematics). So, on Day 14, we would begin our macro-P phase work, using, for this case of a length targeting gains campaign, our ADS for as much time per day as we can muster (at the start of the phase, tapering off usage a little each day until we reach zero usage 4 weeks later). There are two very important aspects of P-phase work. The first applies to all P-phase work: The P-phase work, whether it’s length supporting, as in ADS or girth supporting, as in cock ring, should be done at a relatively low level. The one thing we don’t want to do is have the P-phase work appear to our body as I phase work. That is an extremely counterproductive occurrence. So keep the ADS tension low and the cock ring not too tight. With respect to macro-P phase work, it’s very important that we taper the usage from high-P phase/low R phase at the beginning of the macro-P phase to low-P phase/high-R phase at the end of the macro-P phase. The idea is to have a smooth handoff to the macro-R phase.

If we are to continue to chase gains during this gains campaign (which I don’t recommend) we will have to accelerate the velocity of our work, which means that we’ll have to increase the rate of our increase in work. Again, the magnitude of this increase can be solved for explicitly by means of calculus or graphically, but it requires that one has plotted their gains vs. Time. For those that haven’t, using a work multiplier coefficient of 1.15 and increasing the frequency of sessions to every other day will approximate the indicated rate increase that I’ve computed in most of my analyses. So, in this example, the 3rd week’s training would consist of:

Day 15: 293 jelqs x 1.15 = 337 jelqs, Day 17: 337 jelqs x 1.15 = 387 jelqs, Day 19: 387 jelqs x 1.15 = 445 jelqs, Day 21: 445 jelqs x 1.15 = 512 jelqs.

Notice that at the ~3 week point, our work has increased relative to our starting point, by a factor of ~ 2.5. So this regimen corresponds well with the regimens that I’ve calculated (again, based on MY physiological response systematics).

The most fundamental difference that this PE training philosophy has with that of many others that one may find on the Forum is that it’s truly cybernetic, as the form of one’s training is prescribed by the form of one’s physiological response to one’s training. Another important aspect of this training protocol that is in sharp contrast to many others is the importance of tissue healing. It’s the most important part of the protocol.

I’ll be on Big Dick Island. I wish you all good luck in your efforts to navigate to it. If you’d like to have more than luck on your side, I suggest that you find, formulate or adopt a strategy. Feel free to adopt mine.

I’ll keep an eye out for sails on the horizon. There’s almost always an offshore wind, but if you’re an able sailor with a sound strategy, you’ll find the lee shore.

Godspeed.

Finding xeno: a penis tale

P.S. Please tells us how you gain with this

Quik

I started PE much like you did the manual hand route, jelqing and the like. Honestly, I couldn’t keep interested - too much time and too little measurable gains. As a joke, I bought a penis pump and started using it infrequently…along with my infrequent jelqing sessions. I’ve even tried the pill route - Enzyte and ProSolution (both of which I can’t really recommend). I didn’t really get serious about it until earlier this year when I found Thunder’s Place and heard about all the other methods and success stories. Since then (January) I have gained a solid .5” (at least) in length and about 3/8” in girth.
I’m probably the worst PE-er out there - I don’t really keep very good track of a specific routine, but here’s what I do:
1) Daily herbal/vitamin therapy:
Vitamin E (800mg), Fish oil (2400mg), generic multi-vitamin, tribulus terestis (1800 mg), Saw Palmetto berry (900mg), Ginseng drops (1000mg), and a combo of L-Arginine (1,250mg) & L-Ornithine (750mg) 3 times a day. I also occassionally take “chondroitin” which is for healthy joint tissue although I believe that it aids in the flexibility of ligaments as well.
2) ADS - I purchased mine on ebay - the “EcoExtender”. Here’s the secret for comfort: put on a condom first, then wrap, then strap in Mr. Goodbar and stretch. I stretch during the week with weekends off and wear it MOST of the day. I tend to stretch hard - to the maximum I can handle. I take 5-10 minute breaks about every hour and a half.
3) Pump - the good ol’ penis pump - usually on tuesday, wednesday and thursday I pump, 2 15-minute sessions - around lunchtime and at some point in the afternoon. I start with a low pressure for about 10 minutes, then high pressure for the last 5.
4) Soft stretch…If I’m going to take an extended break or at the end of the day, before I unstrap from the extender, I wrap up so my penis looks like a mummy which keeps it in a semi-stretched state until bedtime.
5) Hanging - when my gains slow I hang during my lunch - as much weight as I can handle, as long as I can handle it. Typically, I do this for about 20 minutes for two consecutive days about every third week.

Kegels: do them daily. 3 sets of 15 short kegels (about 1 second duration); then 5 one-minute.

I’m thinking of adding jelqing back into my routine, maybe twice a week.

There has been discussion about masturbating to ejaculation affecting gains - probably true for many. I do know that when I avoid masturbating for any length of time, my erections come more easily and are harder. I don’t believe that ejaculation affects permanent gains, even though it may slow their coming.

Best of luck - don’t get discouraged. No matter what routine you start, even if it works, there will be times where you’ll gain a lot one week and then nothing for the next two weeks.

Originally Posted by Majortom75
I would use a hot washcloth for 5 minutes then do 5 or 6 one minute stretches. I’d warm up again with the washcloth and then try to jelq at about 80% but maintaining that wasn’t easy. Maintaining a consistent 80% erection level was a balancing act between thinking about work when I was too hard and thinking about sex when I wasn’t hard enough. Some times it would take a minute to get back to the right level and I would factor that lost minute into the total length of my routine.

Actually the 80% figure is an estimate; the way that I would gauge what I thought was a good level was at the beginning of my jelq session I would do a couple of strokes and see if my glans looked like it had the texture of an orange peel. If my head wasn’t engorged enough to get the orange peel look I would try to get it a bit harder and then try to maintain that level just by feel, but never what I would consider a full erection. After a few minutes my glans would smooth out which is why I would look at the texture at the beginning of my session. I kegel at the end of one stroke and grab the base with the other hand before releasing the pressure of the first stroke.

That seemed to work for me. Hope it helps.


Thanks for clarifying your routine.

What sort of schedule did you do - 1 on/1 off, 5 on/2 off, etc.?


The aim of life is self-development. To realize one's nature perfectly - that is what each of us is here for.

~Oscar Wilde~

Pud: How fast are your jelq strokes?

Also, re: masturbating, is this the type of ejaculation schedule you suggest

PE, PE and jizz in the evening, rest, PE, PE and jizz in the evening, rest, etc.

OR would this be better:

PE, PE, rest, PE, PE and jizz in the evening, rest, PE, PE, rest, PE, PE and jizz in the evening, rest, etc.


The aim of life is self-development. To realize one's nature perfectly - that is what each of us is here for.

~Oscar Wilde~

Originally Posted by The Beasty One
quik4life, has it occured to you that maybe you’re doing too much? Maybe you’re too dedicated? If I were you, I’d give myself a decon. break of around 2 months, and then start on a relaxed newbie routine with double the amont of warm-ups. If that doesn’t work, keep adding to the Newbie Routine slowly until you find something that works.


The words “decon break” keep going off in my head.

I think one may be in order.


The aim of life is self-development. To realize one's nature perfectly - that is what each of us is here for.

~Oscar Wilde~

thinkerer:

That’s a pretty intense routine. To be honest, I don’t know if I have that much time/privacy to carry out all of methods that have led to your gains.

I do believe that supplements (and exercise) and important (but not necessary) when it comes to PE gains.

I’m really starting to believe what you said: “I don’t believe that ejaculation affects permanent gains, even though it may slow their coming.”

Thanks for the encouragement.


The aim of life is self-development. To realize one's nature perfectly - that is what each of us is here for.

~Oscar Wilde~

I think you should have an extended de-con break. And once that’s over with, start PE from point blank - from the start. Maybe you missed your optimum growth routine and continued to add more and more, when really you might well be the type of person that grows quickly with the Newbie Routine - or something similarly lax. The only way to know is to re-trace your route.


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