Point at which you feel kegal

Sappy1,

>Do you think it is possible that my prior attempts at BTC hanging were fruitless because the Ligs and The Tunica were splitting the weight to evenly?<

Well, this is one of the points of the LOT theory and goes along with the divide and conquer method. If you have a low LOT, and are hanging BTC, then whatever stress the ligs take is probably useless and takes stress away from the tunica where it could do some good.

>This could have made it very hard for me to fatigue anything at the weights I was hanging because I never was able to isolate the ligs.<

With a low LOT, isolating the ligs will do no good because there is no gain potential within the ligs.

>I remember a while back someone’s theory that maybe this could end a ‘see-saw’ battle between the tunica and ligs. I don’t remember who it was, but maybe there is merit to this.<

Could be, but I do not see how it can be very effective. It will be very interesting to see how the LOT values, of beginning low LOT guys, are affected by only working the upper angles. If the LOT values increase, then they might be able to make gains by working the lower angles.

Bigger

Bigger,

My LOT is roughly 9/10 o’clock. My erection angle is usually about 8 o’clock (pisses me off), and I’ve gained 1.5” length, about 0.4-0.5” girth after roughly a year PE’ing, mostly manual stretching but a bit of jelqing each day too.

Tell me, did your erection angle decrease after starting PE? What about the quality of your erections? I say this because a lot of people post on this forum complaining about having shitty erections through manual stretching.

Myself, I can’t really say I did much PC work at all over the past year (lets just say I have worked it out more times this past week than I did in the whole year previously) which may show hope for rectifying this problem but I’d rather hear some facts from someone in the know-how such as yourself who has gained a tremendous amount through lig stretching.

If the erections aren’t back to normal within a couple of weeks I think it may be time to retire from PE. Whats the use of having a big dick if I can’t even get it up?

I stopped manual stretches for about a week but after reading all 15 pages of this thread I decided to do some lig work in hopes of gaining a little more length, but I’m a little worried that I’m doomed to a poor erection for the rest of my life because of it (if the effects are permanent).

awwwshucks,

>Tell me, did your erection angle decrease after starting PE? What about the quality of your erections? I say this because a lot of people post on this forum complaining about having shitty erections through manual stretching.<

My erection angle did decrease from about straight up to a little above 9:00. I attribute most of this to gravity. Before PE, I had started experiencing a little ED, and the quality of my erections had gone down. Since PE, the quality has gone way up, almost to the level of my early thirties. However, while I was PEing for gains, I did experience temporary periods of poor quality erections.

>Myself, I can’t really say I did much PC work at all over the past year (lets just say I have worked it out more times this past week than I did in the whole year previously) which may show hope for rectifying this problem but I’d rather hear some facts from someone in the know-how such as yourself who has gained a tremendous amount through lig stretching.<

I highly recommend kegals to improve erection quality. The more the better.

>If the erections aren’t back to normal within a couple of weeks I think it may be time to retire from PE. Whats the use of having a big dick if I can’t even get it up?<

If you have not reached your goals, just take a few more days off, and they will probably come back strong.

>I stopped manual stretches for about a week but after reading all 15 pages of this thread I decided to do some lig work in hopes of gaining a little more length, but I’m a little worried that I’m doomed to a poor erection for the rest of my life because of it (if the effects are permanent).<

If they do not return after a time off, it is a different problem that I shall be addressing within the week. Another Bib theory. Stay tuned and do not worry about it. The mind is truly the greatest problem with poor erections.

Bigger

Now I hope this hasn´t been answered somewhere in these 15 pages… I have read about 10 out of the 15 and didn´t see it asked directly.

For working out my LOT, am I looking for a complete loss of tugback, or just heavily reduced / weak? I would be happy to have a high LOT, and I´d say that mine must be at about 8:00 currently, but there is still a minor amount of tugback at that level. It´s small, but there. In fact, there´s a tiny amount till very far down. I´ve not done much stretching, and I´m only two weeks into my routine, so I wouldn´t expect to have a very low LOT.

What´s the verdict? Does the tugback have to be gone completely? If I do a BTC manual stretch I do feel that familiar burning stretch sensation.

I guess I´m just hoping for some lig gains!

My tug back starts at 12 and finishes at 8.

Will get other info by the end of the day.(i.e erection angle etc.)

ICM,

>For working out my LOT, am I looking for a complete loss of tugback, or just heavily reduced / weak? I would be happy to have a high LOT, and I´d say that mine must be at about 8:00 currently, but there is still a minor amount of tugback at that level. It´s small, but there. In fact, there´s a tiny amount till very far down. <

It could be two things. First, you could have a range of angles where the ligs and tunica are taking various amount of the stress. This would cause a gradual loss of tugback. Or second, you might be going by feel instead of seeing the loss of tugback. Do not judge by the flex of the PC, but rather by seeing the actual tugback.

>I´ve not done much stretching, and I´m only two weeks into my routine, so I wouldn´t expect to have a very low LOT.<

This is not correct. Some guys start out with low LOTs and some start out with high LOTs. The guys that have gained a lot and are low, probably had high LOTs to begin with. That is the theory. An LOT of 8:00 is medium.

>What´s the verdict? Does the tugback have to be gone completely?<

When the actual, visual tugback is gone completely, the ligs are taking all the stress.

Bigger

Thanks for the feedback Bib! Going on visual tugback I´m still seeing a little bit all the way down to about 7:00. Based on it’s appearance and average exit point I wouldn´t have expected to have a low LOT but it´s entirely possible.

To be honest I´m quite confused by what I should be classing my LOT as, as it varies depending on the amount of pull and whether my PC is getting tired after trying so many times! I have various details recorded, and I´ve implemented DLD blasters into my routine, so I´ll just report back in a month or so and I´ll probably be able to tell then.

Thanks Bib!

LOT: 8:00

EA: 9:00

EL: start: 6.00-in, current: 6.25-in

EBPL: start: 6.25-in, current: 7.00-in

EG: start: 5.00-in, current: 5.125-in

Time: 6-months (although very inconsistent, but working to improve that)

Routine:

start: hot wrap (moist) warm-up for 5-mins, manual stretching (hold 10-20 sec) at various angles for 10-mins, wet jelqing for 10-15 mins, hot wrap (moist) cool down for 5-mins

current: same warm-up, JAI manual stretches for 15-20 mins, wet jelqing for 20-30 mins, same cool down; try to do a few JAI stretches throughout the day whenever I can (bathroom breaks, etc)

Thanks for the insight, Bib, this is interesting stuff.

I’m getting pull back from 12-10 o’clock barely noticeable at 9 o’clock.

EA: 10-11 o’clock
ELBP: 7-1/8”

I’d say I gained about 1” length. Been PE’ing off and on for 3-1/2” years, only serious for about 6 month’s when I was 19.

About the inner penis near the anus, with a full erection I can feel my penis all the way up to my anus, it’s very prominent. Distance to exit is about 3.5”.

So I take it I should mainly do lower manual stretching? Is an inch of gains possible with stretching my ligs? Theoretically of course?

If I left anything out let me know.

Thanks and keep up the good work!

Can someone sticky this thread perhaps. Along with DLD’s size study on common tricks and misconceptions, this is the best post I have ever read on the board.

THANKS BIB!!

Another Guy,

Yes, work the lower angles. You should have good potential for gains in your ligs.

Bigger

Hi Bib,

I just happily read through the entire thread, and regret that I hadn’t done so sooner. It’s good to know that the meaning of LOT is Loss Of Tug.

Also, in this case, it looks like every useful answer to the question “What does LOT mean?” (that I’ve seen) has excluded the not-so-difficult-to-type-in-the-first-place phrase “Loss of Tug”, and the only URL I’ve seen linked to has been to the thread and not the “Theory”. I think it’s because people don’t use the “show results as posts” option in the forum software’s search parameters and leave it as the default “show results as threads”.

I’d like to recommend that when proposing new terminology we try to clothe it in some kind of searchable garments (maybe some invisible [SG]ML-type tag?) like “my new acronym is TMS (toss my salad)”, so that one could have good luck searching for a term with something like <br><center>”new + acronym + TMS”</center><p> Just a thought to save the veterans some work.

Anyway, I think that if you’re still accepting data from folks, you might want to append the initial posting with the few clarifications you’ve had to make. Of particular value to me was your posting on what constitutes Loss of Tug. While it is true that everyone(!) should read through the thread, this would save you and the other acronym-wielding Senior Members some work and consternation when confronted by the sloth of the freshly initiated.

Hey pastmynavel,

I fixed your links. Check this link for info on posting links:

/forum/misc.php?action=bbcode

I started to read this thread only yesterday. Here is my data:

LOT: 7:30
Dim: 10”x”5.75” (now), 8.25x4.75 (start), 7”x5” (flaccid, now), 5”x4” (flaccid, start)
Time: 12 months
Gains: 1.75”x1” (mainly the first 2 months)
EA: 9:00
Penis-anus distance: 6”
Techniques: (at start) wet jelqing, stretching, (currently) hanging down, DLD bundle blasters, DLD girth set (7 sets of: 100 hard jelqs, 30 sec DLD horse bends, 20 sec horse).

Bib, what do you suggest for exercises?

Priapos.

Priapos,

You have about exhausted your gains from the ligs. Start concentrating on working the upper angles, SO to OTS. Also, the DLD twists would be good. IOW, all tunica work.

Bigger