Thunder's Place

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more words of caution if you're considering girth surgery

If anyone still wants to invest in girth surgery, please read the info below to be as informed as possible as to the pros and cons of your choice. - Peforeal

From: “Ken” <>**Add to Address Book
Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2004 10:47:01 -0000
Subject: [Surgical_Enlargement_Forum] Ken against Alloderm and “The Future”


Because everyone has jumped on the Alloderm bandwagon does not mean it is a good thing.* This is a cash cow and those who are doing these surgeries are now looking for ways to keep that cash cow paying off.*

There have been numerous problems with Alloderm and it’s intended
usage was not for penile enhancement.* Alloderm was designed for
exterior usage in burn victims with a primary direction towards skin
grafting.* I can currently name 5 enhancement patients who have had
to have this removed several years after the implantation because
severe scar tissue formed around it.*

Next minor little “problem”.

There is NO commonality between tissue harvested from your own body
and “Alloderm”.* The ONLY thing that they have in common is a basis
in human cell structure.* Good, Bad or whatever your own immune
system is NOT going to be “alerted” by something which originated
inside your own body because it is NOT foreign.* Though every effort
is made by the manufacturer to prevent immune responses to Alloderm,
it does not always work.*

Gary Alter has a sterling reputation without a blemish.* I do not see
Gary Alter running to jump on the Alloderm Bandwagon.* The reason is
simple.* He has over the past few years had to yank too much of this
stuff out!* Alter is one of the best of our group, and the fellow who
has by his actions which speak far louder than words stated: “I will
not do girth enhancement BECAUSE we do not have a manner to do it
that is as of right now acceptable to MY OWN SELF IMPOSED

Alloderm has in enhancement surgery had a rather poor reputation in
the past. It gets implanted on the east coast, and surgically removed
on the west coast.* Even if the techniques improve considerably for
implantation, it is still a “foreign body”.* It will take 5-7 years
before the problems with scar tissue will become apparent in some
men.* What is a “good job” now, may not be as the hands of time march
on.* THIS is where the problem lies.*

Gary Rheinschild is a personal friend and has at this time decided
that Alloderm and his techniques combined will equal a good outcome.*
I have the highest respect and love for Gary Rheinschild as an MD,* a
personal friend, and as a great and caring man.* I personally do
reserve the right however to* disagree with his decision with regards
to Alloderm.* Considering Gary Rheinschild’s age, by the time that
late developing problems start to rear their ugly heads, from
surgical procedures performed in 2004 this great man will most likely
be retired from surgical practice.* My personal fear gentlemen is not
the short-term results, but instead the very long-term results
because of a human immune response called “encapsulation”.

There have been cases in female breast augmentation where saline
implants became totally encapsulated in scar tissue over a period of
time, because of this immune response.* When this happens, the scar
tissue and the implant have to be removed and because of the nature
of scar tissue, a great deal of other tissue must be cut away in the
process.* Gentlemen, I can tell you from a rather
interesting “personal experience” some years ago with an “exotic-
dancer” who would in size have made Dolly Parton look small, that
when this takes place these things feel like a bad quality 40 year
old Levitz cheap sofa!* This gal after her retirement from
the “profession” as a stripper and dancer (and I do not mean
prostitution) had to have her whole chest rebuilt and the surgical
problems were extensive.* She made great money, and getting
the “rebuild” cost her about the same as a 5 year old Rolls Royce
Corniche Convertable at the time.** Her name was Judy and she was an
incredible lady and a good friend for many years.*

In a penis, there is no where near the volume of tissue that there is
in a breast, the composition of penile tissue is different, and
because erections (which require elasticity) are involved, you get a
real mess and can go into an artificially created state of Peyronies
if this whole thing goes wrong!* This is NOT good.* Will it happen
with everyone?* NO!* This is one of thouse “Roulette Wheel” things
fellows.* Want to take that chance that it will be you!* By all means
go for the Alloderm!

Gentlemen, there is NO future for most in phalloplastic surgical
procedures at all.* Surgical procedures are a short term solution
that is what we have for now.* The research that “Bubble” has
provided for you is evidence that meaningful treatments and a
legitimate version of “the magic pill” are not as far away as many of
you might think.*

The world of medical research and the cash cow generated by
Pharmaceutical Giants is and has 1000 times the power of ANY surgeon
on the face of this earth.* AGAIN!* Think!* Rogaine!, Viagra!,
Cialis!, the demand and financial rewards of a magic pill to make a
mans “winkie” bigger would be exponential compared to these!* It may
be quietly, but there are incredible sums now being spent to be the
first one out with this one guys!*

It is coming!

In the meanwhile, hey, if you want the lengthening procedure get a
good surgeon and GO FOR IT!* Try some other stuff for the girth and
if you keep the foreign bodies out you’re still eligible for
the “magic pill” when it eventually gets here.*

Best to All


Forum Guidelines PAST: 5.25"L x 4.75"G (base),EBP (January 2001) / PRESENT: 7.50"L x 7.00G (base),EBP It doesn't happen overnight! Commitment! Focus! Patience!/ Main Routine = Pumping/Jelqing/clamping + Homedic TheraP or ACE Wrap TheraP or ACE Wrap


This is the ramblings of one experienced person. I belong to this forum. You can read my postings as chazzippy. I agree with ken in a lot of ways, and do not plan to have the alloderm. I have chosen the absolute best phalloplasty surgeon in the country to increase chance of success.

"Crazy dancin! Making my penis sore!"

- Dave Chapelle


You have obviously already made up your mind on having the surgical procedure. I won’t comment further. May your results be a success story.


Forum Guidelines PAST: 5.25"L x 4.75"G (base),EBP (January 2001) / PRESENT: 7.50"L x 7.00G (base),EBP It doesn't happen overnight! Commitment! Focus! Patience!/ Main Routine = Pumping/Jelqing/clamping + Homedic TheraP or ACE Wrap TheraP or ACE Wrap

Peforeal, crashhex, I found about this forum after someone e-mailed me that a post of mine at John Latreen’s Yahoo group ended up here in Thunder’s Place. After reading quite a few posts I must say that this is probably the best overall board on penile enlargement I’ve come across in quite a while.

Crashhex I echo perforeal when I say good luck in your surgical quest for a larger manhood. Without going too far into our backgrounds, both Ken Beaton and I have been involved various aspects of the penile enlargement community for (11 years in my case) and (20 years in Ken’s case.) Ken, as you may know, was the editor of Penis Power Quarterly along with the late Gary Griffin. I was once the poster boy for a palloplastic physician who wanted to use me as a long dong drawing card for patients. The bottom line is that there is an enormous pool of guys out there willing to sacrifice their penises in the effort to gain an elusive inch.

I realize hope springs eternal, that everybody believes “leaps and bounds” in the state-of-the-art have been made since Dr. Mel Rosenstein, the butcher of Culver City, was carving out what vaguely approximated a VY-Plasty back in the early and mid-nineties , but the fact is very few patients gain long lasting results using dermal grafts and the pain does not equal the gain cutting the suspensory ligament. With the notable exception of Dr. Gary Alter, doctors will not tell it like it is for the simple fact that the financial rewards are too great to resist. As of now, one physician is charging $11,000 for a “dual augmentation” ; the penile procedure that sounds like a Borla exhaust system I put on my ZO-6 Corvette.

Back before the physician I was associated with gave me the dermal graft from Hell, a 9” X 3” strip inserted in my penile shaft taking off half my left buttock, I was privy to the inner workings of the enlargement biz. Patients would come in expecting a cross between the precision of NASA and the professionalism of a TV doctor. In truth, the whole place was a living Theater Of The Absurd and Bizzaro World. I will not go into anything on this forum but I understand nothing has changed in the ensuing years. If anyone (crashhex) venture to have enlargement surgery, think very VERY thoroughly before letting one of these doctors slice open your prized possession.

Keep us updated, we’re be glad to hear your progress


!No diseque sus testículos!


Thank you for taking the time to add your personal post to this thread. I was the one who cut and pasted your message to this forum from John Latreen’s Yahoo group on surgical enlargement. I hope you don’t mind, but I truly felt the content of your message was very important to be read by others. I don’t actively post on John’s group, but I do receive the messages that other members do contribute.

Although each man here has to make his own decision when it comes to weighing the risks and benefits of surgical penis enlargement, I feel a responsibility to provide any information that I may have access to either directly or indirectly. Three and a half years ago, I could have been crashhex or any other guy who’s willing to spend the money and take the chance on penile surgery. I’m so fortunate that I found out about non-surgical methods of enlargement, which have worked substantially for me, as seen in my signature below. It has been a three plus year process, and the attraction of the “quick surgical fix” is so strong, but as the saying goes “patience is a virtue”.

Through the techniques shared on this forum, I’m probably bigger in length and girth permanently than any surgical procedure might have given me. All it required was my time, patience and commitment, which is a pretty small price to pay for the results I have.

Thanks again. Hopefully, now that you’ve found us, you’ll be a regular contributor. Welcome.


Forum Guidelines PAST: 5.25"L x 4.75"G (base),EBP (January 2001) / PRESENT: 7.50"L x 7.00G (base),EBP It doesn't happen overnight! Commitment! Focus! Patience!/ Main Routine = Pumping/Jelqing/clamping + Homedic TheraP or ACE Wrap TheraP or ACE Wrap


- Landshark I am not a crook. (Richard Nixon) I did not have sex with that woman. (Bill Clinton) Iraq has weapons of mass destruction. (Gorge W. Bush) I promise I will not cum in your mouth. (Me)

The total cost of the procedure above.. Phalloplasty and circumcision was $25,604.00

- Landshark I am not a crook. (Richard Nixon) I did not have sex with that woman. (Bill Clinton) Iraq has weapons of mass destruction. (Gorge W. Bush) I promise I will not cum in your mouth. (Me)

Many men regret having penile augmentation surgery.

The fat transfer is not permanent as the body re-absorbs some of the transplanted fat.

Many men elect to have regular “top ups”.

I personally would be happy to have a nice ordinary sized penis and not some mutant salami.

The cosmetic effects can be poor!

Don't do the surgery

Penis enlargement surgery brings out the penis muscle 2 cm out of the body by releasing a ligament. There are thousands of lawsuits overthis surgery ! Nobody, nobody is satisfied. It will function less good, erection angle is lowet, etc. Also the fat triansfer is a bad thing. If you really want your penis to be biggerin the flaccid state take CIALIS. My docter gave my this and it’s fantastic. Your penis will be as long as it’s is in erection. How? Cialis relaxes the corpora cavernosa (=penis) muscle when there is neural stimulation aka. You touches it or there is sexual stimulation. Cialis doesn’t give you an erection , it just facitates it.

Tell this to everyone, if you have questions send them to

Discretie… you be lucky…

I'm pissed of with my gains and loses. I've been doing this for more than 4 years. I keep measuring wrong and the next time I update my signature you will see impressive results.


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