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Penis Size: The True Average

WTF?!?

You guys are giving me a headache.


Running a Massive Co-Front.

Originally Posted by Joe_joe
Post 383, here’s the link again:
http://www.enersol.com.au/CondomSize.pdf


Hormones come to mind. Doesn’t testosterone during and before puberty affect penis size? I think I’ve seen that before. Testosterone has an effect on many things, so it could have been selected for for those other effects and dick size was a side effect. Actually, the studies I’ve seen show that testosterone levels do vary by race and they pretty much follow the pattern you’d expect from the results in this pdf.

Your link doesn’t open, maybe it’s a problem of my browser. About testosterone levels, here you are:
Serum estrogen, but not testosterone, levels differ between black and white men in a nationally representative sample of Americans.

Rohrmann S, Nelson WG, Rifai N, Brown TR, Dobs A, Kanarek N, Yager JD, Platz EA.
Division of Cancer Epidemiology, German Cancer Research Center, D-69120 Heidelberg, Germany.
Comment in:

J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 2007 Jul;92(7):2433-5

“CONCLUSIONS: Contrary to the postulated racial difference, testosterone concentrations did not differ notably between black and white men. However, blacks had higher estradiol levels. Mexican-Americans had higher testosterone than whites..”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17456570

Steroid hormones during puberty: racial (black-white) differences in androstenedione and estradiol—the Bogalusa Heart Study

RJ Richards, F Svec, W Bao, SR Srinivasan and GS Berenson
Section of Endocrinology, Louisiana State University School of Medicine, New Orleans 70112.

Steroid hormones during puberty: racial (black-white) differences in androstenedione and estradiol—the Bogalusa Heart Study RJ Richards, F Svec, W Bao, SR Srinivasan and GS Berenson
Section of Endocrinology, Louisiana State University School of Medicine, New Orleans 70112.

A large biracial cross-section of 1038 healthy children aged 6-18 yr with 519 blacks, 519 whites, 678 males, and 360 females was evaluated for Tanner stage and serum levels of androstenedione, dehydroepiandrosterone-sulfate, blacks and whites were very similar at each Tanner stage with only minor differences in age, height, and weight related to an earlier onset of puberty in blacks. The hormones dehydroepiandrosterone-sulfate, progesterone, and testosterone did not exhibit any racial differences. Estradiol showed a significantly higher level among black males compared to white males (P less than or equal to 0.05) whereas androstenedione was significantly higher in both white males (P = 0.0001) and females (P less estradiol, progesterone, and testosterone. The anthropometric values of the than or equal to 0.01) compared with blacks ….”
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/co…stract/75/2/624


Last edited by marinera : 12-28-2009 at .

Here’s a study I saw before that says blacks have more testosterone:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3455741

Blacks in the United States have the highest prostate cancer rate in the world and nearly twice that of whites in the United States. The 2:1 black-to-white ratio in prostate cancer rates is already apparent at age 45 years, the age at which the earliest prostate cancer cases occur. This finding suggests that the factor(s) responsible for the difference in rates occurs, or first occurs, early in life. Testosterone has been hypothesized to play a role in the etiology of prostate cancer, because testosterone and its metabolite, dihydrotestosterone, are the principal trophic hormones that regulate growth and function of epithelial prostate tissue. This report gives the results of assays of circulating steroid hormone levels in white and black college students in Los Angeles, CA. Mean testosterone levels in blacks were 19% higher than in whites, and free testosterone levels were 21% higher. Both these differences were statistically significant. Adjustment by analysis of covariance for time of sampling, age, weight, alcohol use, cigarette smoking, and use of prescription drugs somewhat reduced the differences. After these adjustments were made, blacks had a 15% higher testosterone level and a 13% higher free testosterone level. A 15% difference in circulating testosterone levels could readily explain a twofold difference in prostate cancer risk.
——————————————-

Anyway, this is just speculation. I heard before that t levels during puberty affect dick size, but that might be wrong. I don’t think there’s a lot of research into this, but there’s a strong possibility that some hormones affect it, and even your links said that some hormone levels were different.

Originally Posted by Joe_joe

….

Anyway, this is just speculation. …

Agree. There is also racial bias in some studies: in the one you linked, for example, (a study done 23 years ago, by the way) a sample of college population in L.A. is studied, than from this sample (how many subjects where studied? I don’t see it is written there.) it is supposed that there is a difference in T levels in the whole USA population, than again it is supposed that this could explain difference in prostate cancer.

The studies I posted are more recent, one of them is dated 2007. They didn’t noticed any statistical difference in T levels. I think also difference in prostate cancer can have many other causes - say diet, style of living, etc..

Even difference in T levels could have other causes than genetic: just for example, a few studies noticed that not married men have higher T levels than married : what’s the marriage rate among blacks/mexicans compared to whites?


Last edited by marinera : 12-27-2009 at .

Originally Posted by Joe_joe
… .Anyway, this is just speculation. I heard before that t levels during puberty affect dick size, but that might be wrong. I don’t think there’s a lot of research into this, but there’s a strong possibility that some hormones affect it, and even your links said that some hormone levels were different.

Yes it is — speculation

This is going to sound odd and may of already been brought up before.
But you know that we are talking about different countries averages,has anyone ever tried working out the WORLD average?

Because that would probably be a good way to look at it from a universal perspective.
If anyone does have the world average please send me a message.


Current Stats: 6.9BPEL/6.4NBPEL 5.5MEG.

Current Goal: 7BPEL/6.5NBPEL 5.75MEG.

Originally Posted by RickM
Yes it is — speculation

There’s a lot of speculation on this board. How often do you point out that it’s speculation on those threads? Do my speculations make you angry? Do you hate discussions of human biodiversity?

Originally Posted by marinera
Agree. There is also racial bias in some studies: in the one you linked, for example, (a study done 23 years ago, by the way) a sample of college population in L.A. is studied, than from this sample (how many subjects where studied? I don’t see it is written there.) it is supposed that there is a difference in T levels in the whole USA population, than again it is supposed that this could explain difference in prostate cancer.

The studies I posted are more recent, one of them is dated 2007. They didn’t noticed any statistical difference in T levels. I think also difference in prostate cancer can have many other causes - say diet, style of living, etc..

Even difference in T levels could have other causes than genetic: just for example, a few studies noticed that not married men have higher T levels than married : what’s the marriage rate among blacks/mexicans compared to whites?

I don’t see why just using college students is a big problem. If black college students have higher t levels, how likely is it that white non-college students have higher t levels? And that they have just enough to make it even out? Non-genetic causes certainly exist, and that’s a problem, but probably not for college students.

Black college students in L.A. have higher T levels than white college students in L.A. according to that, isolated study.

>>Non-genetic causes certainly exist, and that’s a problem, but probably not for college students.<<

Why not for college students? I’d say expecially for college students.

For example, it is well known that the level of physical actvivity influences T levels; now, in your objective opinion, who makes on average an higher level of sport, black college students, or white college students?

I find odd that, to find the causes of prostate cancer, the researcher has done a study on college students, don’t you? Were blacks and whites studied under same circumstances? Same diet, just to say one?

Let’s remember that estrogen (estradiol) is what is carcinogenic and really causes prostate problems much more so than testosterone. Although you may here and read different online, many HRT professional specialists will argue that, and so will I. And I know A LOT about that hormone nonsense.

Originally Posted by marinera
Black college students in L.A. have higher T levels than white college students in L.A. according to that, isolated study.



what study isn’t isolated?

Quote
>>Non-genetic causes certainly exist, and that’s a problem, but probably not for college students.<<
Why not for college students? I’d say expecially for college students.
For example, it is well known that the level of physical actvivity influences T levels; now, in your objective opinion, who makes on average an higher level of sport, black college students, or white college students?

I find odd that, to find the causes of prostate cancer, the researcher has done a study on college students, don’t you? Were blacks and whites studied under same circumstances? Same diet, just to say one?

When I was thinking non-genetic factors, I was just thinking about marriage. It’s a good point that there’s other factors.

Originally Posted by ironaddict69
Let’s remember that estrogen (estradiol) is what is carcinogenic and really causes prostate problems much more so than testosterone. Although you may here and read different online, many HRT professional specialists will argue that, and so will I. And I know A LOT about that hormone nonsense.

Do you know if they affect dick size?

Originally Posted by ironaddict69
Let’s remember that estrogen (estradiol) is what is carcinogenic and really causes prostate problems much more so than testosterone. Although you may here and read different online, many HRT professional specialists will argue that, and so will I. And I know A LOT about that hormone nonsense.


Yes, the evidence is certainly pointing that way, but the jury is still out. Nevertheless, it behoves those on testosterone to be careful what they do and properly monitor total and free testosterone levels (so they know what they’re doing) and oestradiol. Make sure your oestradiol levels stay in the lower half (prfeferably the lower quartile) of the “normal” range.

As far as I know, taking testosterone will not affect dick size, but it will result in your balls atrophying unless you take hCG. It’s a case of lose it if you don’t use it. Also, there is some evidence that very high testosterone levels can cause a lowering of your sex drive. I dunno if that is because of the TT itself or higher oestrogen levels.

This thread really should be stickyed.

It’s one of the few discussions of an average that isn’t completely skewed by over-representation of large guys.

So basically the average white male size is around 5.2-5.5 nbp and 6 bp.

I wonder which drug was used to achieve a maximum erection?

seconded

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