Loading, lengthening, healing.

In regards to the periodization theory, I’ve been thinking about doing 3 month blocks of techniques geared towards either girth or length. With a 7 day “break” (only stretching) in between.

However I think that in both stages there needs to be a certain percentage of work done towards the lesser of the two goals for the block you’re in. For example if you’re in a girth block and doing a 3 on 1 off routine, you’d want to have the second day be hanging instead of clamping. Then the next week, the third day would be hanging. Then the next week, the first day of each three days on would be hanging.etc This way you’re rotating your routine around a bit.

I know it seems weird to stop a certain routine if you’re gaining, but for some reason I think that 3 months is long enough for your unit to adapt, and that changing at this time and attacking it from another angle will continue gains as opposed to letting a plateau set in. It seems as if by the time a plateau has set in, your unit has frozen up a bit and settled in a less pliable state.

Any suggestions or comments?

We never made an experiment on the periodization approach, so I think it would be safer giving it a try only when your gains are stalling - if ain’t broken don’t fix it.

Doing a day in the week dedicated to retain gains achieved in the previous phase makes sense; but it also makes sense don’t do that because you want to decondition your unit to that stimuli. So, it’s kinda a battle on which of the 2 makes more sense. To me, the second option seems better, but the choice could also vary from a specific case to another.

Can you direct me to studies or evidence that shows that 3 hours daily is enough?

Could we say that this difference is one induces fatigue, and the other creep?

You are probably right about different phases. Scratch what I said on my earlier reply today about jelqing, then wearing an extender.

About the wearing time of extenders
marinera - Loading, lengthening, healing.
this refers not specifically to penis; extenders manufacturers generally say that the minimal amount of time required is 2-3 hours daily.

About progressive static stretching
Stretchers and Stress Relaxation

>>Could we say that this difference is one induces fatigue, and the other creep? <<
Yes. The first tends to cause "cracks", the second foremost creeping and viscoelastic elongation.

On a side note, Kojack, I seem to remember that your foremost problem was that you wasn’t able to be consistent on a given routine. If this is the case, just do a simple manual routine, and is very likely that you get gains if you are consistent.
Just my 2 cents, of course.

Yes marinera, I haven’t been able to stick to a routine. That is why I have not been able to gain.

I have to admit that it is hard for me to stick to a manual routine. For some reason, I don’t have much faith that I will gain from manual exercises alone. I know that guys do, and thousands of threads here are the evidence, but I have a problem with believing that I will gain from manual exercises.

If I can break it down mathematically, like using a pump or an extender, I tend to get more excited about a routine. When I first found this site, back in 2003, I did a pump/jelq routine like avocet8. I did it for a month, or slightly more. That’s the longest I’ve ever stuck to a routine. Seeing my cock in the pump made me feel better, and I had more faith in that type of routine. I didn’t stick to it more than 6 weeks at the most, if I remember correctly.

Even when I start a manual routine, I start to think about PE theory again. I can’t stand not knowing what is happening on the microscopic level. Its a habit for me. I feel like we are so close. We are scratching at the wall. It frustrates me, and it also stimulates my mind. I absolutely love trying to solve a problem and researching thins. I do suck at sticking to a schedule or plan though, big time!

I PE’d Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. I did about 130 jelqs a day, and some light stretches. I didn’t do any jelqing Monday, but I did a few light stretches. In my mind, I didn’t get anywheres. Only right after jelqing, while my cock is plump, do I feel like my routine was worthwhile.

That’s why I’m always looking for more answers. I’m going to keep writing and posting because that’s what keeps pressure on me to get a daily PE session done. Its like I have to be here and involved in order to stay motivated enough. Even that hasn’t worked in the past, but it has been working for the last four days.

Ok, I will do about 135 jelqs and a few stretches today, and try to think positive thoughts.

Always stay positive. (Hey, I have superpowers and I see your penis growing at microscopic levels! ;) ).

merinera, I can’t help but dig through the forums again and read about “how” permanent gains may be happening.

Posts #102, and #103, posted by you, were both really good.

You discussed how CT length needed to be taken beyond the elastic range and into the plastic range to create permanent deformation.

I then ask myself, “how much tension is needed”, and “how long should the tension be applied for”?

Dorn, I’m running in circles.

If the CT is not stretched into the plastic range, no permanent gains have been created, right? Elastic creep is probably gone by the next day right? Then it’s back to square one.

Haha, you are hooked buddy. :)

>> how much tension is needed and how long? <<

Well I don’t know how much tension is needed to have permanent elongation in the case of TA; it would also vary from man to man. But we can’t doobt it has to be a high tension. The main point, I think, is that if one wants to cause permanent deformation, FORCE is the major factor; time is a secondary factor.

I think it can help visualizing the penis as a hemp rope

~ http://upload.w ikimedia.org/wi … Hanfstengel.jpg

if it can stand, as a max weight, say 100 kg, then applying for a few seconds 110 kg wil break the rope; apllying 90 kg for say 10 minutes will break some of the fibers; how much time you do need to break a significative number of fibers applying a 30 kg force? An enormous amount of time.

It makes sense that some fibers in the tissue have different strength than others, but I don’t think many fibers will have a so low strength to be broken with less than half of the max weight of the strongerr fibers in the same tissue. But if applied for enough time, some fibers wil be consumed at microscopic level. To reach a significative amount of damage, a long time will be required, however.

>>If the CT is not stretched into the plastic range, no permanent gains have been created, right? Elastic creep is probably gone by the next day right? Then it’s back to square one.<<

The way I’m reading this bunch of stuff, is

a) the elastic properties of the tissue will allow to reach a longer state;

b) the viscous properties of the tissue will allow to mantain this longer state for more time than was need to reach that max lenght.

There are other factors that help to take advantage of this gap between [time required to elongate - time required to return at previous length] : nervous factors, un-crimping fibers, maybe cellular proliferation, tissue memory etc.. It helps also having daily erections: while sleeping expecially, because in the REM phase you have so hard erections that TA is stretched to his max lenght or near that.

So: it’s true that elastic creep is not ‘gain’ if you are meaning creation of new matter in the tissue (at least in a significative amount); but it is also true that, due to "creeping of tissue", or "dumped elastic elongation", the tissue is longer for a not so short amount of time.

Yes, speaking of creep, that is what I meant. It does diminish. On the other hand, if it diminishes slow enough, the creep of the next PE session may not have to start back at square one. That’s what you described about extenders.

If I remember correctly, the amount of time used to stretch CT had an affect on how slowly the creep would dissipate. It was something like ten times the amount of time under tension. If an extender was worn for 4 hours, it would take 40 hours for the creep to totally disappear. If the extender was used again 20 hours later, the individual would not be starting over at square one.

That was what one my threads was about, but I haven’t been able to prove anything.

Following this type of thinking, the plastic range must be reached within one session for a manual session to create plastic deformation, because the tension was not applied for much time, and that would mean that the creep would dissipate before the next PE session.

About daily erections, including nocturnal erections, that may be why the micro failures do not heal in a contracted state. Stretching the following day may keep the micro failures from contracting also. Otherwise, I think that some contraction might occur.

There are several reasons why the penis doesn’t heals ‘in a shorter state’. Just to say one, micro-tears healing in connective tissue is not based on scar production. Scar is produced in connective tissue only as a consequence as a gross tissue rupture, like tunica tears. But you don’t want to cause macro-tears, you do want to cause micro-tears.

There is a book that I would like to record the title of for future references.

Functional soft-tissue examination and treatment by manual methods

By Warren I. Hammer

It is on Google Books

Page 20 is the most specific regarding permanent elongation.

Page 21 discusses cyclic loading

Page 19 shows a load deformation chart for Connective Tissue ( a stress-strain curve)

Oh, thanks for explaining that scar tissue is not created as micro tears are healing, but only when healing macro tears.

Whether or not scar tissue was created was debated here. In fact, some members discredited the micro failure, or micro tear explanation, on the grounds that scar tissue would be created, and that it did not seem to have been created in penises that were enlarged.

I’m glad that you have posted that information marinera. When did you discover this?

/forum/showthread.php?p=1238816#post1238816

as a bonus, the comment of Firegoat on that study:
/forum/showthread.php?p=1239100#post1239100

http://books.go ogle.co.uk/book … ching&f=f alse

For anyone who wants a good basic understanding of stress/strain/elasticity/collagen/creep/effects of temperature etc. as a background knowledge to help understand some of the research articles that have appeared in this excellent thread, this is worth reading.

Start around page 56 and read to page 61 or so. From there skip to page 71 for a list of the variables involved!

Actually it’s worth starting long before page 56, but that’s a lot of reading.

By the time you finish it, you will have answered many questions you have, and created many more. Have fun!

Haha, thanks Figo. :up:

Pages 44-45 are also interesting.