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Knowing whether you are limited by Dorsal Thickening/Septum

Originally Posted by LongVehicle
I think marinera may be on to something with the plaque idea. I’m not sure what “plaque” is here, but the chord I have does not seem normal. It is HIGHLY resistant to stress…extremely tough.

For some reason, this makes me think that low force for long periods of time would be better than using high force that may just cause a strengthening of the chord.

Maybe what happened is that this chord, which is prevalent in all men, thickened due to stress with some unusual collagen deposits. This is what I feel from my self-examination…I am sure I did not have this feeling before my year of clamping, 100% sure that I did not have such a strong and precise limiting factor (although I do not remember the chord at all, so I can’t pinpoint if it thickened or not).

LV, have you tried IR+fulcrums?
It really kills my cord.


BPEL: 7.25"

HG: ~6.25" | MEG:6.25" | Low shaft EG:6.5" | BG: 7"

I wonder if Big Girtha has this as well? He has had major problems gaining length after his girth work…maybe this is the cause behind length gains being hard to attain after periods of intensive girth work? Maybe girth work encourages this build up more than length work?

Originally Posted by Gyrta
LV, have you tried IR+fulcrums?
It really kills my cord.

Have you seen gains since noticing the chord as the sole limiting factor?

I use IR light in all of my sessions, but I no longer hang or stretch. What kind of fulcrums are you doing?

Intuitively, if the plaque hypothesis is right, it would be more logical to use lower stress for longer periods of time.

Originally Posted by LongVehicle
Have you seen gains since noticing the chord as the sole limiting factor?

I use IR light in all of my sessions, but I no longer hang or stretch. What kind of fulcrums are you doing?

Intuitively, if the plaque hypothesis is right, it would be more logical to use lower stress for longer periods of time.

I really don’t buy the DT-theory but doing fulcrums after every stretch helps very well with my cord.
I’m using my wrist and bend my penis over it. It’s easier to stretch after a fulcrum.
But if it contributes to gains, I have a hard time to believe it. I didn’t do any fulcrums last month and I really noticed the chord bud I gained 0.3”.

Maybe I should add that it was the only month I didn’t do any fulcrums.


BPEL: 7.25"

HG: ~6.25" | MEG:6.25" | Low shaft EG:6.5" | BG: 7"

Originally Posted by marinera
Even if you pull upward? Or to a side? Or hanging instead than pullin with your hand?


Yes, yes, and yes.

Originally Posted by marinera
Anyway, I can’t see how your article (why there arent’ pics?) is supporting what you seay. It is speaking of normal structure of penis. DT is something that all people have. And 5 o’clock, 11 o’clock- it doesn’t make any difference. This all reminds me the Bib’ speech on LOT.

You’re slicing the penis wrong (Ouch. It hurts just to say that!). What I mean is, the “hours” of the clock I’m referring to above are based on a transverse section of the penis. They’re not based on the angle of tugging.

For example (and please forgive the graphic language), hold your pecker straight out and slice it off with a sharp knife. Now look at the bloody stump end-on. The spot where your dorsal vein is oozing blood is nominally called the 12 o’clock position. Your CS and urethra are nominally at the 6 o’clock position. The hours are arranged from the perspective of someone standing in front of you staring at your bloody stump with a shocked expression.

We’re not talking about LOT hours here; we’re talking about the location around the circumference of the penis.

Originally Posted by marinera
The OP of this thread, and the one who originated this (extenders and septum), they believe they are hardgainers because have this ‘cord’. Now, you say : “Well, it’s because we, unluckly, have the DT”.

Since DT is quite normal, most of people should be hard-gainers. So regular (length) gainers become, in your hypothesis, abnormal, because they don’t have DT: this seem a paradox.

That’s not what I’ve been meaning to say. The “DT” and the “cord” are the same thing, yes. For some guys, the DT/cord is no big deal. It resists a little, but not especially more than other parts of the shaft. But, for other guys, the DT is either especially thick and tough to begin with, or becomes thicker and tougher over the course of PE so that it’s the only thing that appears to be holding up their gains.

Originally Posted by marinera
Otherwise said: You are elucidating the structure of TA, but not giving an explanation of why those guys seems not to gain a millimeter in length. You gained 1”. You are cutting out all differences between you an them - the cord, the place where it is, how it feels, the curve - because, it sounds, you want to have this ‘issue’ and it has to be the DT. :shrug:


Okay. Here goes. I think that guys with very thick, dense DTs present a special problem for PE. If your DT is as thick as your achilles tendon, gaining length will be nearly impossible absent some surgical intervention. On the other hand, if your DT is only a few strands thick, it shouldn’t present much of a problem and other structures are likely to attract your attention as possible “limiting factors” much sooner.

Originally Posted by marinera
I know that you want to say : that this DT, normally harder than the resto fo TA, could be actually even harder in some people, but if it is so ‘not stretchable despite any efforts’, wouldn’t it means that there are plaques of abnormal tissue?

I don’t think so. The achilles tendon doesn’t have any plaques and it’s not abnormal. It’s just one thick, dense mother.

Originally Posted by marinera
If those plaques are on the side, than you’ll have a curvature toward the side (if the rest of the penis is regularly conformed). If are in the middle, than you’ll have an upward curvature (if the rest of the penis is regularly conformed) and you’ll fell this ‘tough cord’.

I think you’re assuming that the plaques are the same as the cord. I have no idea whether guys with dorsal plaques can feel their cords the same way we feel them. For all I know, the cord problem we’ve been describing is a PE-induced condition that non-PE’ing guys just don’t experience. Conversely, guys with cords generally don’t have plaques unless they have Peyronie’s Disease. The two things are quite different. Upward curves may be the consequence of plaques on the septum. I don’t know that they’re necessarily the consequence of cords, however.


Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

Check me on this, but I understand that plaques are essentially lumps of scar tissue having randomly arranged collagen fibers.

On the other hand, the DT is a very orderly arrangement of parallel, longitudinally oriented fibers all pulling in unison.


Enter your measurements in the PE Database.

I had the cord since before PE. I think it may have gotten thicker though.

Are there any ways to remove this plaque?

Originally Posted by ironaddict69
I had the cord since before PE. I think it may have gotten thicker though.

Mine is Pre-PE aswell.

Sorry for jumping in here without reading the entire discussion.

For this “cord” that you guys are talking about. You all seem to mention that for some doing a BPFSL measurement the penis thins out like a pencil and for others it stays relatively thick. From what I understand it seems like those who stay fairly thick have a limiting cord or at least more limiting cord than those who thin out. (comparing stretched girth to typical girth).

Then would doing a Stretched Flaccid Girth (SFG) measurement and then comparing it to a normal FG or EG measurement be of any indication of how limited you are or how thick your “cord” is?

For example, I am 5.0” girth erect, 4.5” girth flaccid, and only 3.0” girth or less when stretched out. That’s quite a considerable difference I would say. I definitely do not feel like I have this cord, or at least not a very strong / thick cord, that you guys are discussing. Currently I am experiencing fast length gains.

Basically what I am trying to say is I have a 2.0” girth difference from EG to FSG and 1.5” girth difference from FG to FSG. Is this typical? How do others who claim to have this cord differ from EG or FG to FSG?

Originally Posted by ModestoMan
…..
Okay. Here goes. I think that guys with very thick, dense DTs present a special problem for PE. If your DT is as thick as your achilles tendon, gaining length will be nearly impossible absent some surgical intervention. ….


I don’t think so. Achille tendon becomes thicker in runners, but it doesn’t becomes less elastic: this can only happen in case of overuse and leads to inflammation and sometimes in rupture. Achille tendon is a good example : it is thick, but it exibits the typical behavior of any tendon: short-time elongation, plastic deformation etc..
See here for example
Tendons properties

I posted elsewhere an experiment on Achilles tendon that showed that after few minutes of cyclical strain at very low tensions, it mantains an elongated state. So, it indicates that, despite being thick, if the tendon is ‘healty’ or ‘normal’ it is stretchable when the correcto amount of force x time is applied.

We assume tha TA is very similar to tendons (although it was never demonstrated, I think), so a thicker TA is not ‘undeformable’ if you don’t have some abnormality: congenital or pathological overproduction of collagenous tissue, typically.

Originally Posted by ModestoMan
….
Conversely, guys with cords generally don’t have plaques unless they have Peyronie’s Disease. The two things are quite different. Upward curves may be the consequence of plaques on the septum. I don’t know that they’re necessarily the consequence of cords, however.


Not true. Not every guy who has a curve has a Peyronie’s Disease. And I’m using the term ‘plaque’ referring to abnormal collagenous deposition, also not necessarily placed on the dorsal section. I posted this study before:

“We investigated the ultrastructure of the tunica albuginea in individuals with congenital penile curvature to explain the pathology of this disease.

…In the study group the tunica albuginea structure had a chaotic pattern of collagen fibers that formed bundles with disrupted 3-dimensional organization. Diameter of the fibers differed greatly on cross section. We observed periodic widening and fragmentation of collagen fibers with the complete disappearance of striation and transformation into electron dense, fibrous granulated material…”

Link

Now, do you think the penis of this guys would be less or more stretchable than ‘normal’ penises? And what would be the consequences of an aggressive PE regimen? Probably an even more chaotic pattern, disruption and formation of fibrous, granulated material?

Originally Posted by marinera
I don’t think so. Achille tendon becomes thicker in runners, but it doesn’t becomes less elastic: this can only happen in case of overuse and leads to inflammation and sometimes in rupture. Achille tendon is a good example : it is thick, but it exibits the typical behavior of any tendon: short-time elongation, plastic deformation etc..
See here for example
Tendons properties

I posted elsewhere an experiment on Achilles tendon that showed that after few minutes of cyclical strain at very low tensions, it mantains an elongated state. So, it indicates that, despite being thick, if the tendon is ‘healty’ or ‘normal’ it is stretchable when the correcto amount of force x time is applied.

We assume tha TA is very similar to tendons (although it was never demonstrated, I think), so a thicker TA is not ‘undeformable’ if you don’t have some abnormality: congenital or pathological overproduction of collagenous tissue, typically.

I never said a thicker TA was “undeformable,” just that it is harder to deform than a thin one. The achilles tendon might be deformable, but it’s a whole lot harder to deform than a thinner tendon, and takes a whole lot more force to do so, if I understand correctly.

Most guys have a hard time hanging over 15 or 20#. For those guys, any penile structure that doesn’t deform at these loads is, for all intents and purposes, undeformable, unless some other technique can be applied.

You said that the achilles tendon responds to low force and maintains an elongated state. Exactly how much does it elongate and how long is the elongation maintained?


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Originally Posted by marinera
Not true. Not every guy who has a curve has a Peyronie’s Disease. And I’m using the term ‘plaque’ referring to abnormal collagenous deposition, also not necessarily placed on the dorsal section. I posted this study before:

I don’t know why you’re saying “not true,” since I never said that every guy who has a curve has Peyronie’s Disease. Exactly what did I say that you think is “not true?”


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That every guy who have a ‘plaque’ have the Peyornie’ disease.

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