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Does this prove my penis can be longer?

Originally Posted by Tom Hubbard
This is a genuine extension with the stretch, and I have no reason to think it wouldn’t be the same standing up.

So have you tried it standing yet ?

Originally Posted by Tom Hubbard
This distinction always amuses me, seeing as I introduced BPFSL (“dead stretch”) as a way to approximate BPEL.


While I am happy to amuse you, that was not really the reason I asked. I personally have never had a difference between my BPEL and BPFSL, neither before, during nor after making my gains so I was not suggesting the difference between the two had anything to do with gains, I was wondering if a difference in your BPEL/BPFSL contributed to the phenomenon you are describing in your first post.

Beyond that, there are so many slight variables in the measuring method you describe that could easily add up to 1cm if you add them all up.

I attempted this myself, as best as I could based on your description. If I tense up (kegel) while in both positions I reach the same point and I can only stretch it up further past if I stay relaxed while pulling up… but if I tense my pelvic muscles by kegeling it returns to exactly the same length.

This smells a lot like LOT theory… so my opinion is that I don’t think this phenomenon relates to gains in any way.


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Breathing on your back is more relaxed. You have to see interaction of the pelvic floor as more as the pelvis itself. Many of the organs are contained by the pelvic floor, abdominal wall, etc. Breathing changes the dimension as does breathing (Consciously or otherwise) on your back.

Not a definite explanation, just possible causality.

Originally Posted by marinera
Tom, you introduced BPFSL for that goal; not everybody takes BPFSL for that goal (I think measuring BPFSL was used way before than you introduced it by urologists, by the way).

Never been to one.

Originally Posted by marinera
Actually, using BPFSL to approximate BPEL doesn’t make much sense to me, since you can’t be sure you are always pulling with the same force required to approximate BPEL and since that force probably will vary depending on many variables.


Depends on individual physiology. For me, there’s a max BPFS length I can get, which has always been exactly my BPEL.

Originally Posted by marinera
Ithink tha if you want to know your BPEL, better to measure your BPEL; if you want to know if your penis has become longer, measure your BPFSL.


I would have to be popping Viagra all day long in that case.

All day long? You measure your penis all day long? :)

I agree that the difference between BPFSL and BPEL depends on the individual physiology. For most of people BPFSL >BPEL. For them, BPFSL is useful only to check if there is an increase in length that isn’t showing up for whatever reasons - momentary low EQ, increased girth etc..

Originally Posted by marinera
All day long? You measure your penis all day long? :)

I agree that the difference between BPFSL and BPEL depends on the individual physiology. For most of people BPFSL >BPEL. For them, BPFSL is useful only to check if there is an increase in length that isn’t showing up for whatever reasons - momentary low EQ, increased girth etc..

Not all day long, but my current interest is in exercises that leave immediate gains, so yes, I measure before and after each session. I no longer do long, hard stretches because they invariably leave my BPFSL short than I started. This might be particular to my physiology, but I want to recommend on my site things that work for me, and I am reworking the site yet again.

Originally Posted by cantlook

This smells a lot like LOT theory… so my opinion is that I don’t think this phenomenon relates to gains in any way.

Not sure how you’re getting that connection. As I recall, that had to do with Kegeling at different angles; never really could get into it. Still, entirely possible that this phenomenon is unrelated to potential gains, which is why I asked for other peoples’ opinions and experience.

If you stretch upward, you are mostly stretching the underside of your penis; this is very elastic since it is not covered by the tunica albuginea. I think you should notice the same difference when you stretch standing, if the penis is very near to your body. For example if I pump at a very high angle, I get a longer measurement than pumping SO.

Just as I side note, I don’t think there are ‘immediate gains’, if we are speaking of stable gains.

Originally Posted by Tom Hubbard
Not sure how you’re getting that connection.


LOT theory, in my opinion, was based on a misinterpretation of how the penis reacts at different angles and what that meant for potential growth.

You are talking about interpreting how your penis is reacting to being pulled at a certain angle as a possibility for potential growth.

The similarity seems obvious to me.

Like we agreed though, the only way to tell is to grow and see if the stretched distance decreases. Even then it seems doubtful to me because if I could go back a couple years and perform this test I should have seen an almost 2” stretch to account for my gains that I have made up until today, right? I am sure I pulled on my dick a lot before PE and I never noticed it stretch like that!

Ultimately, I disagree because it goes against what I believe penis growth actually is, which is the creation of new tissue. If we are growing new tissue (as opposed to somehow filling in unused space as your theory would suggest) then there is no way to tell how much “potential” there is before hand.


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Last edited by cantlook : 11-24-2013 at .

Originally Posted by cantlook

Like we agreed though, the only way to tell is to grow and see if the stretched distance decreases. Even then it seems doubtful to me because if I could go back a couple years and perform this test I should have seen an almost 2” stretch to account for my gains that I have made up until today, right? I am sure I pulled on my dick a lot before PE and I never noticed it stretch like that!

My question was that if you see a difference, does that represent potential? Conversely, if you see no difference, does that mean no potential? If so, this would be a valuable insight for someone starting out. Your reductio ad absurdem approach does nothing to address that.

Originally Posted by cantlook

Ultimately, I disagree because it goes against what I believe penis growth actually is, which is the creation of new tissue. If we are growing new tissue (as opposed to somehow filling in unused space as your theory would suggest) then there is no way to tell how much “potential” there is before hand.

May be. “Filling in unused space?” With what? New tissue? Umm, sort of lost me there…again….

Originally Posted by Tom Hubbard

My question was that if you see a difference, does that represent potential? Conversely, if you see no difference, does that mean no potential? If so, this would be a valuable insight for someone starting out. Your reductio ad absurdem approach does nothing to address that.

It wasn’t a ‘reductio ad absurdem’ approach… simply pointing out that it could not be an 1:1 representation of potential so at best it it could only be a fractional representation of potential yet there are way too many variables in this, and your measurement method, to get a measurement that would be accurate to fractions of a centimeter.

Originally Posted by Tom Hubbard

May be. “Filling in unused space?” With what? New tissue? Umm, sort of lost me there…again….

I meant instead of filling a cup with more water, we are actually making a bigger cup. Can you follow that?


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Last edited by cantlook : 11-24-2013 at .

It is absurdum, boys. :D

Originally Posted by marinera

It is absurdum, boys. :D

Sorry… I’m LSL (Latin Second Language). ;)


Keep an open mind and a closed wallet... unless it\'s open to making a donation!

Originally Posted by marinera

It is absurdum, boys. :D

Me dum. Be Murkan what grew ups widout all dis Latin /Italian stuff.

Originally Posted by cantlook
It wasn’t a ‘reductio ad absurdem’ approach… simply pointing out that it could not be an 1:1 representation of potential so at best it it could only be a fractional representation of potential yet there are way too many variables in this, and your measurement method, to get a measurement that would be accurate to fractions of a centimeter.

I meant instead of filling a cup with more water, we are actually making a bigger cup. Can you follow that?


Maybe I’m grasping at straws. After 2003, I mostly bugged out of the PE scene, thinking I had nothing more to contribute. A few times since, I’ve thought, “Well, maybe.” While my main raison d'être (did I get that right Marinera?) has been to slice through the endless complexification that seems to infect Western minds, (amply evidenced here) and encourage people not to open their wallets for a bigger dick (except to make donations: nice signature!), my original delight at having achieved the “impossible” spurs me on to pursue what might be silly tangents.

Intuitively, following the lead of temporary gains (this and the B&A measuring) attracts me. For now. And no, I don’t understand your metaphor.

Further note: fractions of centimeters are called millimeters, which are surprisingly more easy to read on a ruler than fractions of an inch. OBTW :D

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