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Another Size Thread


Another Size Thread

BIOLOGY: I read few days ago that the average girl needs ONLY 1 (one) inch for getting pregnant and 3 (three) inches for being satisfied.
And that is because most nerves are located at the entrance of the vagina, and there is also the clit which is placed outside and it seems that He is responsible for 90% of her pleasure.

MYTH: The psychological aspect in which women prefer large cocks comes from the ancient history (Egypt) where it seems that the “phallus” was worshipped. They also had many statues representing the male organ (huuuuge ones) and it was believed that men who were big could bring fertility, prosperity and were very appreciated for their manhood..

I just wanted to live that moment in which there is no info about cocks with no questions such as ” bigger is better, smaller is better, average, etc” Just take it as it is. I guess there wouldn’t be any more discrimination if there was no history inducing the idea of “large”

Just wanted to share this info with you guys:)

I still think it’s all in our heads.

G_want7's log

2007: BPEL: 5.1 / MSEG: 4.5 / 2008: BPEL: 6.5 / MSEG: 4.8

I think it's amazing, the way that love can set you free...

I don’t know how much practical sexual life you have, but I have two kids, 10 years of happy marriage behind me and more coming (that’s not a record, but it’s not a “two times or less” either) and I have discovered that every time, I use a cock ring which seriously engorges my dick, my wife enjoys the sex a lot more. Regardless of her knowledge of the cock ring being applied. In fact this knowledge brought me here in first hand.

Sex is not about math. It’s not binary in a ways of stimulation on/stimulation off. I believe that 1 inch talk needed for getting pregnant. In fact one does not need a penis at all for this purpose. There are other ways to get the sperm in to the vagina. Penis just delivers it more efficiently to the safest place for it to be. But I can not take seriously the 3 inch talk about satisfaction. Well, again, you don’t need a penis for this purpose either. You have your hands, your tongue, etc. And of course there are some women for who a 3 inch dick may be enough. But for average women in order to really enjoy the sex, 3 inches are clearly not enough. With 3 inches one does not have the space to move (what’s the use of the dick if you can’t move it), list of possible positions is very limited etc - who wants to live a sex life hampered by such a little dick. Do ya? I imagine that even masturbation is very difficult with such a minuscule dong.

So, this is no info that you are sharing. Bigger dick GIVES more pleasure. Regardless of your beliefs. Plus it gives to the male side better self confidence and to the female side a psychological enjoyment.

Pointing to history - large penises have been worshiped in different tribes long before ancient Egypt became an empire that we now know of.

Started: oct 2007 with 11.8 cubic inches

Currently: apr 2008 12.8 cubic inches

Objective: >20 cubic inches

In part, I agree with Karl too, and I’d like to make it clear that my first post on this thread, was a reply to:

I just wanted to live that moment in which there is no info about cocks with no questions such as ” bigger is better, smaller is better, average, etc.

G_want7's log

2007: BPEL: 5.1 / MSEG: 4.5 / 2008: BPEL: 6.5 / MSEG: 4.8

I think it's amazing, the way that love can set you free...

Then why is the clit positioned OUTSIDE the vagina?

Even after all these years Masters and Johnson’s “study” results from the mid 1900s are still quoted to this day in an effort to state that the vagina is practically numb beyond the first three inches. However, subsequent researchers have debunked it. Masters and Johnson were HUSBAND and WIFE. Hello, red flag. For all we know he may have had a small penis and his wife doctored the results.…09.2006.00325.x
The Journal of Sexual Medicine
Volume 3 Issue 6 Page 979-987, November 2006

To cite this article: Rachel Pauls MD, George Mutema MD, Jeffrey Segal MD, W. Andre Silva MD, Steven Kleeman MD, Vicki Dryfhout, MA, Mickey Karram MD (2006)
A Prospective Study Examining the Anatomic Distribution of Nerve Density in the Human Vagina
The Journal of Sexual Medicine 3 (6), 979–987.

Introduction. Women possess sufficient vaginal innervation such that tactile stimulation of the vagina can lead to orgasm. However, there are few anatomic studies that have characterized the distribution of nerves throughout the human vagina.

Aim. The aim of this prospective study was to better characterize the anatomic distribution of nerves in the adult human vagina. A secondary aim was to assess whether vaginal innervation correlates with the subject’s demographic information and sexual function.

Methods. Full-thickness biopsies of anterior and posterior vagina (proximal and distal), cuff, and cervix were taken during surgery in a standardized manner. Specimens were prepared with hematoxylin and eosin, and S100 protein immunoperoxidase. The total number of nerves in each specimen was quantified. Enrolled patients completed a validated sexual function questionnaire (Female Sexual Function Index, FSFI) preoperatively.

Main Outcome Measures. A description of vaginal innervation by location and an assessment of vaginal innervation in association with the subject’s demographic information and sexual function.

Results. Twenty-one patients completed this study, yielding 110 biopsy specimens. Vaginal innervation was somewhat regular, with no site consistently demonstrating the highest nerve density. Nerves were located throughout the vagina, including apex and cervix. No significant differences were noted in vaginal innervation based on various demographic factors, including age, vaginal maturation index, stage of prolapse, number of vaginal deliveries, or previous hysterectomy. There were no correlations between vaginal nerve quantity and FSFI domain and overall scores. Fifty-seven percent of the subjects had female sexual dysfunction; when compared to those without dysfunction, there were no significant differences in total or site-specific nerves.

Conclusions. In a prospective study, vaginal nerves were located regularly throughout the anterior and posterior vagina, proximally and distally, including apex and cervix. There was no vaginal location with increased nerve density. Vaginal innervation was not associated with demographic information or sexual function. Pauls R, Mutema G, Segal J, Silva WA, Kleeman S, Dryfhout V, and Karram M. A prospective study examining the anatomic distribution of nerve density in the human vagina. J Sex Med 2006;3:979–987.

This article is cited by:
Bulent Erol, MD, Oner Sanli, MD, Duzgun Korkmaz, MD, Ayse Seyhan, MD, Tolga Akman, MD, and Ates Kadioglu, MD. (2007) A Cross-Sectional Study of Female Sexual Function and Dysfunction During Pregnancy. The Journal of Sexual Medicine 4:5, 1381–1387
Abstract Abstract and References Full Text Article Full Article PDF
Alessandro Zucchi, MD, Elisabetta Costantini, MD, Luigi Mearini, MD, Fabrizio Fioretti, PhD, Vittorio Bini, BS, Massimo Porena, MD. Female Sexual Dysfunction in Urogenital Prolapse Surgery: Colposacropexy vs. Hysterocolposacropexy. The Journal of Sexual Medicine doi: 10.1111/j.1743-6109.2007.00570.x
Abstract Abstract and References Full Text Article Full Article PDF
An annotated bibliography on orgasm and related subjects

Human sexual arousal and orgasm

Freud, S. 1905 Three essays on the theory of sexuality (1905) Standard Edition
Hogarth Press, London, Vol, 1953, pp. 125-245.

Presents Freud’s model of normal psychosexual development in females. Argues
that females have two independent erotogenic centers: the infantile erotogenic
of the clitoris and the mature erotogenic zone of the vagina. Clitoral
arousal was seen as a sign masculine libido, whereas vaginal responsiveness
was the essence of felinity. Freud’s ideas were probably treated more rigidly
and dogmatically by his followers than did Freud, however, the impact of these
ideas should not be minimized. This formulation of female sexuality has
essentially dominated the last 80 years and has filled the coffers of many a

Dickinson, RL and Pierson, HH 1925 The average sex life of American women.
J.A.M.A. 85:1113-1117.

One hundred women were studied to try to determine the role of the clitoris in
female sexual response. One of the earliest attempts to provide scientific
data concerning female orgasm.

Dickinson, RL 1933 Atlas of Human Sexual Anatomy. Williams & Wilkins,

Dickinson was not only a researcher and practitioner, he was also a superb
illustrator. This volume contains an impressive collection of detailed
drawings of human reproductive anatomy. Provides detailed measurements of
variation in male and female genitalia. Many of the drawings were based upon
direct observation of vaginal reactions during arousal using a lighted
transparent tube. A forerunner of Masters and Johnson that actually provided
more information that their later book.

Mahoney. JJ and Withschi, E 1947 Genetics of the female prostate in rats.
Genetics 32: 369-378

Detailed genetic analysis of the prostate in female rats. Reports in the
incidence in various strains of rats as raging from 0-66%. Through selective
breeding authors increased % from 28% to 99%. Thismay seem an out of place
reference, but its relevance will be apparent later when female ejaculation is

Elkan, E 1948 Evolution of female orgastic ability - A biological survey
(parts I-II). Int. J. Sexol(1):1-13 & 2(2):84-93.

An attempt to address female orgasm in an evolutionary context. Not a
particularly successful attempt, but entertaining nevertheless. Elkan argues
that “fixing” mechanisms have evolved in species that allow the male time to
inseminate the female. In many lower species these are mechanical taking the
form of hooks and barbs that impale the female, preventing her from leaving
before insemination is complete. In species where the male cannot hook the
female there are behavioral immobilizing mechanisms (such as lordosis). Elkan
goes on to argue that orgasm is not one of these mechanisms and therefore
does not occur in animals (with the exception of teleosts and swans!!!).
Thus, women should not be concerned if they do not experience orgasm because
it is a gift and not part of their phylogenetic due. An anorgasmic woman
should be no more concerned than should be a woman unable to play a piano!
(Summary from secondary sources)

Kinsey, AC, Pomeroy, WB, and Martin, CE 1948 Sexual Behavior in the Human
Male. WB Saunders, Philadelphia

For an entomologist from Indiana, this was a radical departure. Became a
scandal and an academic cause celebre. Still the most complete survey on male
sexuality ever done. Used a somewhat scientific method that relied upon
lengthy face to face interviews that were somewhat structured. Authors had no
way of verifying the truth of the statements people made, but did do extensive
inter-interviewer checks. Shows that males employ a wide variety of sexual
outlets and that greater than 98% routinely have an orgasm during sexual
activity. Presents evidence that preadolescent males have capacity for
multiple orgasm which decreases throughout late adolescence and early
adulthood. Also shows that male sexual activity peaks in late 20’s and goes
down from there.

Gräfenberg, E 1950 The role of urethra in female orgasm Int. J. Sexol.

The article that is credited as first recognizing the role for the
paraurethral glands in female orgasm. He never used the term “G-Spot” that
came much later from Beverly Whipple and associates. Gräfenberg does describe
an area under the anterior wall of the vagina that swells upon stimulation.
He also described the release of fluid upon orgasm. This paper went
relatively unnoticed until the 1970’s. (Summary from secondary sources)

Kegel A Sexual functions of the pubococcygeus muscle West. J. Surg. Obstet.
Gynecol. 60: 521-524

Kegel was primarily interested in nonsurgical treatment for stress
incontinence in woman. Found that it could be treated if women learned how to
exercise the P.C. muscle. Subjects volunteered that their sexual
responsiveness to intercourse increased after kegel exercises. Several women
who had previously never had orgasm during intercourse, now did. Has other
nice side benefits like protecting against uterine prolapse. Seems like a bad
design in the place, though. Too much depending upon too few muscles.
Another article that was largely ignored until picked up by popular press.

Kinsey, AC, Pomeroy, WB, Martin, CE, and Gebhard, PH 1953 Sexual Behavior in
the Human Female. WB Saunders, Philadelphia

Equally as controversial as the first book, maybe more so since it was one
thing to talk about males and quite another thing to talk about females as
sexual beings. Presented data suggesting that females too have varied sexual
lives, but less varied than males. Suggests a much later onset of orgasm in
females than males and lower life time incidence. About 14% of sample
reported multiple orgasms. About 10% of sample reported never having
experienced an orgasm. Not possible to get a clear estimate of percentage of
females not routinely experiencing orgasm. Authors argued strongly against
the “vaginal” orgasm, suggesting that all orgasms involved clitoral
stimulation (or surrounding tissues (see Bergler and Kroger below).

Bergler, E and Kroger, WS 1954 Kinsey’s Myth of Female Sexuality., Grune &
Stratton, New York

Written by a Freudian Psychoanalyst and a gynecologist this book harshly
attacks Kinsey’s work. This is a truly scary book to read for it illustrates
the constraining nature of the neofreudian psychoanalytic position. Instead
of considering any of Kinsey’s data objectively, all data which disagreed with
psychoanalytic doctrine was dismissed as lying, sublimation, or guilt
reduction. I can’t imagine that any women treated by these folks would ever
be found sexually normal. Argues against Elkan’s position that orgasm is a
gift, by arguing that neuroses are all that stand in the way of any women
having vaginal orgasms(by their estimates, this occurs in less that 20% of

Price, D and Williams-Ashaman, HG 1961 The accessory reproductive glands of
mammals in: Sex and Internal secretions (WC Young, ed); William and Wilkins;
Baltimore; pp. 366-448

Description of the accessory glands in lames and female in a variety of
species, prostatic analogues appear in a variety of species. The human
doesn’t appear to have a true prostatic analogue, but does have the
“para-urethral glands of Skene” which have ducts opening directly into the
urethra. These glands are probably vestiges of the primordial Wolffian ducts
and might be preserved to varying degrees depending upon individual female
androgen levels during differentiation.

Masters, WH and Johnson, VE 1965 The sexual response cycle of the human
female, 1. Gross anatomic considerations. In; Sex Research New Developments
(J Money Ed); Holt, Rhinehart, and Winston; New York; pp. 53-89. (This is an
updated version of Masters and Johnson’s article of the same name is West. j.
Surgery, Obst. Gynecol. 68: 57-72; 1960)

This article describes M&J’s approach to human sexual response where women
were filmed during sexual response cycles. Vaginal reactions were filmed in
many subjects through a transparent plastic “penis”. M&J developed the notion
of four arbitrary phases in sexual response and then proceeded to treat them
as entities that are independently measurable (“a good plateau phase”).
Subjects in these studies ranged from paid professionals to volunteers all
studied under the not lights of the laboratory. This and the companion
article resolved the vaginal-clitoral debate in favor of the clitoris.
Authors saw no evidence of “female ejaculation” in their filmed studies.

Masters, WH and Johnson, VE 1965 The sexual response cycle of the human
female, 2. The clitoris: Anatomic and clinical considerations. In: Sex
Research New Developments (J Money Ed); Holt, Rhinehart, and Winston; New
York; pp. 90-112. (This is an updated version of Masters and Johnson’s
article of the same name is West. j. Surgery, Obst. Gynecol. 68: 248-257;

Describes anatomical changes in the clitoris and surrounding tissues during
sexual excitement and orgasm. Does not provide real data on any conclusion
presented in the article, but emphatically states conclusions. Clitoral
erection may be present in 50% of women. Points out that direct contact
between penis and clitoris is difficult. Suggests that clitoris is indirectly
stimulated during intercourse be traction on the labia. Makes a clear break
from Freudian notion of “mature” vaginal orgasms and “infantile” clitoral
orgasms. Says most women prefer two to three orgasms before they are sexually

Masters, WH and Johnson, VE 1966 Human Sexual Response. Little, Brown, Boston.

This book was truly revolutionary in 1966. Unlike the Kinsey reports, this
book was based upon actual observation under laboratory conditions of 382
women and 312 men. The fact that M&J had actually seen what they reported
gave their conclusions much more weight than they may have warranted. M&J
have never really presented any true summary data from these studies so that
others could judge whether M&J had a representative sample. Similarly, it has
never been clear which of their conclusions were forced upon them by their
data and which they selected appropriate examples to support their own biases.
Still, this was seen as the wooden stake in the heart of Freudian views of
sexuality. Was also reassuring to males when M&J concluded that erect penis
size bore little relation to either flaccid penis size or the ability to
facilitate a female’s orgasm. However, looking back, the some problems of
methodology, interpretation, and reporting were present in this book that are
in all their others. M&J are very influential, but not good scientists.
Later Investigators arguing for vaginal orgasms (the new kind) cite this along
with Kinsey and Hite as leading to two decades of “cliterocentricity”.

Brown, DG 1967 Female orgasm and sexual inadequacy In: An Analysis of Human
Sexual Response, (R. Brecher & E. Brecher, Eds), Andre Deutsch, London, pp.

Presents a very nice historical perspective on the issue of female orgasm.
Traces the controversy over the Freudian view of the vaginal orgasm.
Describes the two schools of Freudians that argued for the maturity of the
vaginal orgasm (Helene Deutsch, Marynia Farnham, Marie Robinson, G. Bychowski
(male), and our friend Bergler) and the other group of psychoanalysts that
argued for the importance of the clitoris and against any transition from
clitoral to vaginal sensitivity (Therese Benedek, Majorie Brierley, Karen
Horney, Clara Thompson, Judd Marmor [male], and S. Rado [male]). Has an
excellent bibliography which the reader is referred to as the original sources
cited there are not annotated here.

Masters, WH and Johnson, VE 1970 Human Sexual Inadequacy, Little, Brown,

Treatment for sexual dysfunction based upon Human Sexual Response. This was
the source of the “squeeze technique” to treat premature ejaculation.
Developed the system of sensate focus to progressively increase female arousal
and sensation leading to orgasm. Created a great controversy through the use
of sex surrogates for both males and females to aid the development of sexual
adequacy, this book claimed tremendous success rates that do not appear to
have been supported either in M&J’s work or others. However, the ideas in
this book have dominated the last 19 years of sex therapy.

Fox, CA and Fox, Beatrice 1969 Blood pressure and respiratory patterns during
human coitus J. Reprod., Fertil 19: 405-415

A strange little paper on the authors physiological responses during
intercourse. Shows a nice relationship between her orgasms while his speeds
up. She vocalizes during orgasm, he doesn’t. Also shows that nice guys don’t
necessarily finish last. Still, scheduling the subjects was easier in this
study than most.

Newman, HF 1970 Vibratory sensitivity of the penis Fert. Steril.

Tested penile (and toe) sensitivity to a vibratory stimulus in 100 males aged
17-88. Found an age-graded change in sensitivity with a sharp decrease in
sensitivity at 65 years of age. In a separate comparison found a
relationship between male vibratory sensitivity and occurrence of coitus at
three times 35-44, 45-53, and 65-74. In all cases in couples that did not
have coitus during a year, the males vibratory threshold was significantly
higher than in couples that did.

Fox, CA and Fox, Beatrice 1971 A comparative study of coital physiology, with
special reference to the sexual climax J. Reprod. Fertil. 24:319-336

Replots extensive blood pressure data from dogs published by Pussep (1933, in
German) during copulation. Authors suggest when all of the data are presented
(claims others have selectively used parts of the data) then there is a clear
relationship between changes in female BP and male ejaculation. It wasn’t so
apparent to me that this was the case. Presents the BP data from a 37
year-old male and a 32 year-old female married 10 years (guess?) showing a
similar change in BP in relation to her orgasms. Argues the male ejaculation
triggers orgasm in females of several species, maybe. Not a clearly though
out comparative study, but brings diverse data together in one place. Much of
the monkey work that looked so exciting in 1971, is now not seen that way.

Sherfey, MJ 1972 The Nature and Evolution of Female Sexuality, Vintage Books,
New York.

A very interesting and readable book by a female psychoanalyst, who happened
to take her human sexuality course from Kinsey before he had published his
landmark books. Her view of female sexuality is definitely shaped by M&J’s
work and she is definitely in the cliterocentric camp(“The term “vaginal
orgasm” is perfectly permissible as long as it is understood that the
thrusting is effective because it stimulates the clitoris., p.86). Argues
that orgasm is not a simple thing for women and requires lots of stimulation.
Presents the novel (and unsupported) argument that the rise of circumcision
was to desensitize the male penis so that males could last long enough to
facilitate female orgasm. Makes as much sense as the cleanliness argument for
circumcision.. Sherfey also takes the evidence of multi-orgasmic potential
and cyclical sexual interest to suggest that the “…forceful suppression of
women’s inordinate sexual demands was a prerequisite to the dawn of every
modern civilization and almost every living culture.” (p. 138). And here you
thought it was related to the invention of agriculture (on the other hand when
would there be time to plant crops without a little forceful suppression of
women’s sex drive?).

Hite, S 1976 The Hite Report: A nationwide study on female sexuality.
Macmillan, New York.

A large, but poorly controlled survey of women in the ’70s. Most interesting
for its extensive use of quotations from the thousands of surveys Hite
distributed through any means available. It is not possible to get any real
statistical information from the book as the survey actually kept changing
throughout the project. Also some subjects (anal intercourse is one example)
were left out because Hite found them personally distasteful. The book seems
to portray women as sexually more active and assertive than Kinsey’s report,
but that may be primarily due to the more conversational style of Hite’s book.
She definitely is part of the cliterocentric world so despised by the

Robbins, M and Jensen, GD 1978 Multiple orgasm in males J. Sex. Res.

Feeling left out, the males decide to get into the thick of it. This article
(by a woman) presents evidence from three fully adult males that they
experience something that myographically and by verbal report appears to be
rapid serial orgasms with a single ejaculation on the last orgasm. Kinsey
nicely showed that young males have this ability (or young males showed
Kinsey) but lose it as they get older. This author suggests we can get it
back, if we really want to.

Sevely, JL and Bennet, JW 1978 concerning female ejaculation and the female
prostate J. Sex Res. 14(1):


A decent historical case for the existence of female ejaculation by a woman
who went on to get her JD degree from Tulane. A good use of precedents to
make the case that female can ejaculate. As the authors point out, this paper
only provides the background to show that women can ejaculate, it is up to
others to show that they do. unlike later citation of this paper would lead
one to believe, there is no evidence in this paper that directly suggests that
women do ejaculate.

Graber, B and Kline-Graber, G 1979 Female orgasm: Role puboccoccygeus muscle
J. Clin. Psychiat. 40: 34-39

Sample of 281 women divided into never orgasmic (153), clitorally orgasmic
(114), and orgasmic during intercourse without direct stimulation (24). They
reported that the first group lifted only 7.4mmHG with their PC muscles, the
second group 12.3, while the last lifted 17.0. The differences were
significant. They suggested this demonstrated the importance of PC muscle
tone in orgasm during intercourse.

Califia, P 1979 Lesbian sexuality J. Homosexuality 4(3):255-266

Survey of 286 homosexual women who were self-selected for participation (286
returns from 2000 questionnaires). Only 7 of 268 responders had never
experienced orgasm. 53% experienced first orgasm masturbating, 22% with a
female and 18% with a male partner. 71% did not fake orgasms, 20% did, and 7%
did with males, but not with females. Survey provided no data about relative
occurrence of orgasm or frequency of sexual activity.

Levin, RJ 1981 The female orgasm - A current appraisal J. Psychosom. Res
25(2): 119-133

A good and very complete review of the state of female orgasm as of 1981.
Nicely points out that everything isn’t actually as neat as M&J would have had
us believe and that the four phases of arousal and resolution have conceptual
problems. Tries to disentangle the physiological response from the
psychological perception and meaning of it. Doesn’t resolve the issue, but
points several profitable directions for discussion.

Perry, JD and Whipple, B 1981 Pelvic muscle strength of female ejaculation:
Evidence in support of a new theory of orgasm J. Sex. Res. 17(1): 22-39

47 subjects were tested for the strength of their PC muscle and the strength
of voluntary uterine contractions. Subjects divided into ejaculators(E) and
nonejaculators(NE) by self-report. The PC muscle contractions of Es(11.8uv)
were significantly stronger than those of NEs (6.7uv). The same was true for
voluntary uterine contractions. These data support the notion that a strong
PC muscle is associated with E. They wouldn’t support the idea that female E
is actually stress incontinence due to a weak pelvic floor.

Weisberg, M 1981 A note on female ejaculation J. Sex Res. 17(1): 90-91

A brief comment from a male MD about how he discovered female ejaculation.
Seems one of the speakers at a professional meeting, when challenged to prove
that female ejaculation existed did just that later in a hotel room. Says
that the ejaculated fluid was milky. Also all of his patients “who went home
to experiment found the Gräfenberg spot”. I don’t know if this means everyone
found it, some didn’t go home, or that some didn’t experiment.

Roughon, PA and Kunst, L 1981 Do pelvic floor escercises (sic) really improve
orgasmic potential? J. Sex Marit. Ther. 7(3): 223-229

46 women who had not had an orgasm during the previous two years were assigned
to one of three groups: PC exercise, relaxation, and control. At the end of
twelve weeks PC strength and orgasmic function were assessed. The PC exercise
group had stronger PC muscles, but a comparable number of women experienced
orgasm in each group (actually the control group had the highest proportion
experiencing orgasm). Authors argue that increasing strength of PC muscles
isn’t sure way to orgasm. Data support that doing nothing is best (control
group had greatest improvement).

Belzer, EG Jr 1981 Orgasmic expulsions of Women: A review and heuristic
inquiry J. Sex Res. 17(1):1-12

Considers the evidence for orgasmic expulsion of fluid and rules out urine,
the Bartholin’s glands and the vagina as sources. Concludes that a “female
prostrate” is embryologically possible and could be the source of the fluid.
Doesn’t present any really quantifiable data, but another decent historical

Addiego, F, Belzer, EG Jr., Comolli, J, Moger, W, Perry, JD, Whipple, B 1981
Female ejaculation: A case study J. Sex Res. 17(1): 13-21

Subject suffered from stress incontinence and expelled fluid at orgasm. She
learned to suppress orgasm to avoid embarrassment. Through Kegel exercises,
she learned to control urinary incontinence and found that orgasmic expulsions
still occurred. Samples of the fluid were collected by authors under very
crude conditions and after digital stimulation of the “G-spot”. These samples
showed higher levels of PAP(a prostatic enzyme) than found in urine, but the
levels are also three orders of magnitude lower than seen in male prostatic
fluid. There is also a problem of no control for volume differences in the
ejaculation fluid samples and the urine samples. This convinced a lot of
people that female ejaculation exists and it comes from the female prostate.

Bohlen, JG 1982 “Female ejaculation” and urinary stress incontinence J. Sex.
18(4): 360-368

Suggests several cogent criticisms of previous work on “female ejaculation”.
Points out that a simple way of ruling out urinary incontinence is to
administer a blue dye (Urosed) which would color the ejaculate if it is urine.
Also argues that the presence of Prostatic Acid Phosphatase (PAP) doesn’t
mean ejaculation since all of the studies have used digital stimulation of the
urethral length, PAP could have been expressed from the Skene’s glands.
Presents a systematic set of steps that should be used to verify female
ejaculation. Hasn’t been done yet.

Goldberg, DC, Whipple, B, Fishkin, RE, Waxman, H, Fink, PJ, and Weiberg, M
1983 The gräfenberg spot and female ejaculation: A review of initial
hypotheses J. Marital Sex Therap. 9(1): 27-37

Study of 6 ejaculators and 5 nonejaculators. Both groups of subjects were
comparable in terms of parity, history of stress incontinence, physical size,
and background. Subjects had examinations by trained gynecologists not privy
to the research hypotheses. Subjects provided urine and ejaculate samples
(ejaculators only, of course) for analysis of PAP, urea, and creatinine.
There was no difference between the groups in the existence of a palpable
Grafenberg spot. The “ejaculate” samples were chemically indistinguishable
from urine. This study did not support any of the earlier contentions by some
of these same authors. The study was fairly rigorous and the authors did not
appear to pull any punches in analyzing the data.

Heath, D 1984 An investigation into the origins of a copious vaginal discharge
during discharge during intercourse: “Enough to wet the bed” - that “is not
urine” J. Sex Res. 20(2): 194-215

The belated publication of the author’s rejected 1979 paper brought up to
date. This set out to be what Seveley and Bennet did in 1978 with some data
from the author’s practice. Argues that females do ejaculate something that
is not urine. Presents evidence that the volume of the ejaculated fluid can
be quite large and does not have the ammonia smell of urine upon drying. Also
argues for a place of increased sensitivity of the anterior wall of the vagina
that is related to the glands surrounding the urethra.

Belzer, EG Jr., Whipple, B, and Moger, W 1984 On female ejaculation J. Sex
Res. 20(4): 403-406

Since a well-controlled study was apparently not good enough for these folks
(see Goldberg, et al, 1983), we are presented with some more intriguing pilot
data. The authors did not actually supervise the collection of samples and
cannot say how they were actually obtained. Seven new subjects contributed
“ejaculate” for analysis. These seemed to differ from urine, with one woman’s
sample well within the normal male ejaculate range for TIAP (used to be PAP)
(15,000 units vs. 2.4-155 for the other samples). Why are these samples more
clearly different than urine, whereas the other ones in Goldberg’s study
weren’t. It is interesting to note, that in the previous study an attempt was
made to explicitly avoid bias. There is no sense of controlling for bias in
this study at all.

Tepper, SL, Jagirdar J, Heath D, and Geller, SA 1984 Homology between the
female paraurethral (Skene’s) glands and the prostate Arch Path Lab Med 108:

Using anatomic and enzymatic techniques establishes a homology between the
female paraurethral glands and the male prostate. Argues that the glands in
the two sexes are the same.

Zaviacic, M 1984 Enzyme histochemistry of the adult female prostate: Hydrolase
and dehydrogenase distribution Cellular and Molecular Biology 30(6): 537-543

A detailed enzymatic and anatomical investigation of the paraurethral glands
12 women 15-45 years old. Evidence clearly supports these glands as
homologous to male prostate. The glands are enzymatically very active and are
compartmentalized, with different enzymes in the glandular and the ductal
portions. Author points out that these glands empty into the urethra at
different distances from the meatus and not on either side of the meatus as
has been incorrectly stated elsewhere.

Pollen J and Drellinger A 1984 Immunohistochemical identification of prostatic
acid phosphatase and prostate specific antigen in female periurethral glands
Urology 23(3): 303-304

Seven of 10 women (12-77) were found to have paraurethral glands. In 4 of the
7 having glands a prostate-specific antigen was found. All seven glands had
PAP. Authors suggest the glands are a homologue of the male prostate.

Perry JD 1984 Letter to the editor: G-spot co-author replies to Hoch and
Alzate J. Sex Marit. Therap. 10(2): 142-144

Perry argues with Hoch about whether there is an area of general or specific
sensitivity on the anterior wall of the vagina. The real issue is that Hoch
believes that the vaginal sensitivity is part and parcel of clitoral
responsiveness, whereas Perry thinks there are two separate systems (sound
familiar?). Perry also uses this letter to argue that “… the Goldberg
study, (which) set out to prove that ejaculation was really urinary in

Alzate H 1985 Vaginal eroticism and female orgasm: A current appraisal J. Sex
Marit. Therap. 11(4): 271- 284

A review of the evidence for vaginal eroticism. Traces the controversy over
“vaginal” and “clitoral” orgasms from Freud through M&J’s resolution of them
all to clitoral to the arousal of the “G-spot”. Concludes that all women
probably possess a vaginal zone of sensitivity, but that all orgasms are
actually “cerebral”.

Whipple, B and Komisaruk, BR 1985 Elevation of pain threshold by vaginal
stimulation in women Pain 21: 357-367

Found in 10 women that digital stimulation of the anterior wall of the vagina
significantly increased pain threshold without reducing tactile sensitivity.
This finding certainly might account for people’s tolerance of painful
practices during sexual arousal. Komisaruk has the theory in lower animals
that this is the mechanism that gets the female to tolerate the male’s
intromission, particularly in those species there the male has hook and barbs
on his penis

Harrison, WM, Stewart, J, Ehrhardt AA, et al. 1985 A controlled study of the
adverse effects of antidepressants on sexual function Psychopharmacol Bull
21: 85-88

80% of men and 57% of women treated with phenezine and 50% of men and 27% of
women treated with imipramine reported decreased sexual function. Unclear
whether decrease was solely in orgasm of also arousal. Symptoms disappeared
within 1-3 after medication.

Alzate H and Hoch Z 1986 The “G-spot” and “female ejaculation”: A current
appraisal J. Sex Marit. Therap. 12(3): 211-220

A concise and strong review of the evidence to date for a G-spot and female
ejaculation. Authors agree that there is a place of heightened sensitivity on
the anterior wall of the vagina in many women, but forcefully argue that the
relationship between this area and the female urethra has not been
established. In fact, some evidence places this area at 5cm into the vagina,
whereas the urethra is only 3cm long. This would place the area behind the
urethra. Similarly the authors point out the problems with the female
ejaculate story. They raise a new point that the assays being used be others
which were thought to be specific for PAP actually also measure VAP (a vaginal
acid phosphatase). Contamination by VAP could give elevated PAP levels. The
authors concede that the VAP could come from contamination by PAP from the
ejaculate. Clearly no one knows. They give a final caution that publicizing
things like the G-spot and female ejaculation may enhance the sense of
normalcy of women who expel fluid and have heightened vaginal sensitivity, but
they can lead make other women feel inadequate.

Hoch Z 1986 Vaginal erotic sensitivity by sexological examination Acta Obstet.
Gynecol. Scand. 65: 767- 773

Describes investigations of vaginal sensitivity with 59 couples. Found that
67% of women reported discomfort to stimulation of cervix and 85% reported
high erotic sensitivity to stimulation of full extent of anterior vaginal
wall. 64% of the women reported that they could achieve orgasm by manual or
penile stimulation of the anterior vaginal wall. They also reported that such
stimulation with simultaneous clitoral stimulation was more rapid, intense,
and fulfilling (this makes you think what humans lost when they became bipedal
andbecame missionaries). Author suggests there is no G-spot, but an area of
heightened sensitivity. Further suggests that shouldn’t talk about clitoral
or vaginal orgasms, but “genital orgasms” involving the whole complex of
vaginal, clitoral, and deep structures.

Darling CA and Davidson JK 1986 Enhancing relationships: Understanding the
feminine mystique of pretending orgasm J. Sex Marit. Therap. 12(3): 182-196

Used a questionnaire to study 805 nurses. 58% had pretended to reach orgasm
at least once. Subject variables found that pretenders became sexually
active earlier and were more sexually explorative. Pretenders differed
significantly from nonpretenders in changes they wished in their sex lives on
the measures of more frequent orgasms, more manual stimulation of clitoris,
more assertive self-role in intercourse, intercourse with mutual love, petting
with mutual love, and finding a new sex partner. Results suggest pretending
is related to the dynamic of a specific relationship and not to specific
characteristics of the pretender.

Bressler LC and Lavender, AD 1986 Sexual fulfillment of heterosexual,
bisexual, and homosexual women J. Homosexuality 12(3-4): 109-122

Seventy females self-identified as heterosexual (23), bisexual (22), or
homosexual (25) were interviewed about sexual response and fulfillment.
Subjects were recruited from women’s groups, author’s friends, and from a
“gay/straight consciousness raising group” that the first author participated
in. Bisexual women experienced the highest weekly frequency of orgasm (8.8)
followed by homosexual women (6.2), and then hets (4.7). All of these
frequencies are 2 to 4 times what Kinsey reports for a comparably aged sample
of women. There are no estimates given of regularity of intercourse or the
occurrence of orgasmic difficulties sexual orientation. The article has a
thinly-veiled axe to grind concerning male-female understanding.

Zaviacac M 1987 Letter to the editor The female prostate: nonvestigial organ
of the female . A reappraisal J. Sex Marit. Therap. 13(2): 148-152

Goes through all of the cytochemical and histochemical evidence to justify
calling Skene’s glands, the female prostate. There is no doubt that this
author has presented a wealth of evidence testifying to the secretory nature
of these glands. However, he does not answer Hoch’s concern that he has
provided no estimate about what proportion of the population has these glands.
He may be right that the female prostate does exist, but it may turn out to
be irrelevant to female sexual response. This article doesn’t provide
evidence to the contrary.

Nurnberg, GH and Levine, PE 1987 Spontaneous remission of MAOI-induced
anorgasmia AM. J. Psychiatry 144(6): 805-807

Three case reports (2 female, 1 male) of subjects taking monoamine oxidase
inhibitors for depression. Subjects reported anorgasmia, even though arousal
(and lubrication in females) was still present. Symptoms disappeared after
dosage was reduced or stopped. The mechanism for the interference with orgasm
is unknown.

Rosen, RC and Beck JG 1988 Patterns of Sexual Arousal: Psychophysiological
Processes and Clinical Applications., The Guilford Press, New York

A very current summary of work on sexual function. Has a nice historical
review of each area and articles on the current state of several areas.
Covers the blood-flow monitoring work on sexual arousal (not covered in this
bibliography). Authors remain skeptical about the existence of female

Rosenbaum, JF and Pollack, MH 1988 Anhedonic with despiramine Int. J. Psych.


Two case studies of males treated with the antidepressant despiramine reported
ejaculation without any “feeling”. The treatment appears to have dissociated
seminal emission (the transmission of semen from storage sites through smooth
muscle contractions) from expulsion. It is the expulsive phase of the
ejaculatory process that seems to be associated with orgasm. Authors discuss
(not very convincingly) possible differential neurotransmitter involvement in
these phases.

Weljmar-Schultz, WCM, van de Well, HBM, Klatter, JA, Strum, BE, and Nauta, J
1989 Vaginal sensitivity to electric stimuli: theoretical and practical
implications. Arch Sex. Beh. 18(2):87-95.

Found that the vagina in 60 normal volunteers was less sensitive to electric
stimulation than the dorsal surface of the hand (but then so was the
clitoris). Mean sensitivity threshold for hand was 0.49ma while clitoris was
1.12ma, and vagina averaged 2.6ma. Vaginal sensitivity varied by location
within vaginal with the anterior wall (12:00) averaging 2.0ma, whereas other
areas ranged from 2.4-2.9ma. Subjects were tested under nonerotic conditions
so relation to sensitivity during sexual arousal is unknown. Supports the
idea of a differential topography of vaginal sensitivity. Authors conclude
that differences in clitoral and vaginal sensitivity argue for the importance
of the clitoris in orgasm.

Nonhuman Primate Research on Female Orgasm

*Note: Probably the most famous unpublished data in this area are those of
Eric Phoebus who pioneered measuring heart rate during copulation in
free-ranging rhesus. He found evidence of heart-rate changes like those seen
in human females during orgasm. To my knowledge these data have not been
published beyond abstracts.

Zumpe, D and Michael, RP 1968 The clutching reaction and orgasm in the female
rhesus monkey (Macaca mulatta) J. Endocrinol. 40: 117-123.

The first paper arguing that female rhesus have orgasms. Claimed that the
reaching back that females do during the male’s ejaculation indicates an
orgasm. Evidence is completely circumstantial. Other investigators have
reported that this reach back behavior occurs at times other than the male’s
ejaculatory mount. While this doesn’t argue against this being evidence of a
female orgasm (after all, she could be multiorgasmic), the picture is not as
clear as presented here. Probably when all is said and done it will turn out
that Doris was right all along.

Burton, FD 1971 Sexual climax in female Macaca mulatta Proc. 3rd Int. Congr.
Primat., Zurich 1970 3: 180-191

An example of the human serving as a nice model for the nonhuman primate.
Based upon M&J’s work Frances set out to see if rhesus females could have
orgasm when strapped down to an angle iron frame and stimulated vaginally with
an artificial penis. When the females didn’t try to escape the apparatus or
bite the experimenter they did show three of M&J’s four phases of arousal.
Two of the three animals did show vaginal and anal contractions at some point
during the series of stimulation. Some females showed the “spasmodic arm
reflex”, and some reached back during stimulation to grab the experimenter’s
are or their own genitals. Suggestive results, but it is unlikely that anyone
will ever follow up on this study.

Chevalier-Skolnikoff, S 1974 The ontogeny of communication in the stumptail
macaque with special attention to the female orgasm Contributions to
Primatology 2:

A large monograph on a communication in a small group of stumptail macaques.
First study to report that females also display the open-mouthed display
characteristic of ejaculating males when they are being mated with and during
mounting series with other females. Argument for female orgasm is based upon
the similarity in the behavior and the context in which it occurs.

Goldfoot, DA, Westerborg-van Loon, H, Groenveld, W, and Slob, AK, 1980
Behavioral and physiological evidence of sexual climax in the female
stump-tailed macaque (Macaca arctoides) Science 208: 1477-1479

Provides the clearest physiological evidence in a nonhuman primate of
phenomena similar to those seen in human females. During female-female
mounting a female stumptail provided telemetered information on heart rate and
uterine contractions. When female displayed a male-like “ejac face” she also
displayed a large tonic uterine contraction with several clonic contractions
at 0.7sec intervals superimposed on the main contraction. Also reported that
4/10 intact females displayed the “ejac face” on at least one heterosexual
copulatory sequence with one female displaying them on as many as 40% of
copulations. When this article appeared Dave received an irate phone call
that his article advocated female homosexuality.

Allen, ML. and Lemmon, WB 1981 Orgasm in female primates. Am J. Primatol.

A review of the evidence for orgasm in nonhuman primates with the author’s own
evidence from the digital stimulation of female chimpanzees suggestings that
something akin to interspecies orgasm occurs in chimps (this apparently was
not a reciprocal arrangement). Though this research will probsbly be most
remembered for the original data collected (and the original data collection
method) actually the most bizarre part of this paper is the author’s
suggestion that female orgasm evolved to stimulate male ejaculation. Few
theories on the function of female orgasm have flown in the face of such
counter evidence as this one, but I actually heard the first author present it
at a national meeting in great seriousness and with a straight face.

Slob, AK, Gronveld, WH, and Van der Werff ten Bosch, JJ 1986 Physiological
changes during copulation in male and female stumptail macaques (Macaca
arctoides) Physiol. Behav. 38:891-895.

Reports heart rate and uterine activity for stumptails during heterosexual
copulation. Duplicates Goldfoot’s finding in isosexual copulation of an
increase in uterine contraction associated with an “ejac face”. In this case
it occurs with the male’s ejaculation. Heart rate increases in the female,
but not to the extent reported for the male. Slob reports the “ejac face”
occurred at times when there were no uterine contractions and that uterine
contractions sometimes occurred without the facial behavior. He suggests that
the two are unrelated.

Effects on orgasm on hormone levels

Fox, CA, Ismail, AAA, Love, DN, Kirkam, KE, and Loraine, JA 1972 Studies on
the relationship between plasma testosterone levels and human sexual activity
J. Endocr. 52: 51-58

First author measured T levels before during and alter sexual intercourse.
Wife collected blood samples, but didn’t get authorship. Showed no
relationship between coitus and T level. However, design couldn’t really have
demonstrated one. Also reported no effect of masturbation to orgasm on T in
seven male volunteers.

Goldfoot, DA, Slob, AK, Scheffer, G, Robinson, J, Wiegan, SJ, and Cords, J
19745 Multiple ejaculations during prolonged sexual tests and lack of
resultant serum testosterone increase in male stumptail macaques (M arctoides)
Arch. Sex. Beh. 4: 547-560.

The title says it all. Even when a male stumptail ejaculated 45 times in
three hours there was no discernable increase in T (he wasn’t even breathing
harder either)>

Phoenix, CH, Dixson, AF, and Resko, JA 1977 Effects of ejaculation on levels
of testosterone, cortisol, and luteinizing hormone in peripheral plasma of
rhesus monkeys J. Comp. Physiol. Psychol. 91: 120- 127

There were none. Another case where hormones in rhesus males did not appear
to be influenced by sexual behavior.

Herndon, JG, Perachio, AA, Turner, JJ, and Collins, DC 1980 Fluctuations in
testosterone levels of male rhesus monkeys during copulatory activity.
Physiol. Behav. 26:525-528

Used a remotely controlled backpack with an indwelling catheter to allow
sampling during behavioral interactions. Reported increases in T in some
males, but the increase occurred 30-60 minutes after copulation.

Herndon, JG, Turner, JJ and Collins, DC 1981 Ejaculation is important for
mating-induced testosterone increases in male rhesus monkeys Physiol Behav

Follows up on previous report of increased T following ejaculation in rhesus
monkeys. Found that the increase could be detected with venipuncture if
samples were collected 60 minutes after test. Suggests that it is ejaculation
per se and not other aspects of the testing environment that are important for
the post-coital increase in T.

Carmichael, MS, Humber, R, Dixen, J. Palmisano, G, Green Greenleaf, W, and
Davidson, JM 1987 Plasma oxytocin increases in the human sexual response J.
Clin. Endo. Metab. 64(1):27-31

Studies 9 males and 13 females in the privacy of the lab. All subjects were
hooked up of monitor contractions and have constant blood sampling during
masturbation to orgasm. Both males and females showed a significant increase
in plasma oxytocin (OF) during sexual arousal and orgasm. OF levels were
highest at orgasm and then proceed to decline. Authors speculate that OF may
be involved in the smooth muscle contraction associated with arousal and
orgasm. Expectant parents wonder whether this could prematurely trigger labor
and delivery (and maybe hasten a slow labor).

Prepared by: Kim Wallen
Department of Psychology
Emory University
Atlanta, GA 30322

Annotations are © 1994, Kim Wallen. This bibliography may be distributed
freely if not for profit and if it includes this message.

Nice work, beenthere. :up:

Jeez thats alot of info, I don’t think I’ll ever spend enough time on here to read all of that. That must have taken alot of work.

STARTING STATS -- 9/15/07: Bpel 5.7" • Eg 4.7" • Fl 4" • Fg 4"

4/15/09: Bpel 7.2" • Eg 5.125" • Fl 4.25" • Fg 4.15"

View My Pics, Stats and Routine

Originally Posted by raoul2307
Then why is the clit positioned OUTSIDE the vagina?

That’s so guys with three inch dicks can make women cum too.

2009 Bpel-6 5/8", Eg-5"

2011 Bpel-7 3/8", Eg-5 1/4"

2013 BPEL-7 3/8", EG 5 3/8"

Ever notice how guys with little ones have all those poems to make themselves feel better? It’s not the size of the boat but the motion in the ocean, it’s not how deep you fish but how you wiggle your worm, the clit is the most important that’s why it’s on the outside…… FYI there are five spots total, two with the clit and the roots of the clit, the other three you will just have to find ;)

Big guys such at myself don’t need to make ourselves over compensate because once you hit that spot in a woman that makes her contort like a wrestler and scream obscenities there is no doubt.

Originally Posted by TheGreatDivider
Ever notice how guys with little ones have all those poems to make themselves feel better? It’s not the size of the boat but the motion in the ocean, it’s not how deep you fish but how you wiggle your worm, the clit is the most important that’s why it’s on the outside.. FYI there are five spots total, two with the clit and the roots of the clit, the other three you will just have to find ;)

Big guys such at myself don’t need to make ourselves over compensate because once you hit that spot in a woman that makes her contort like a wrestler and scream obscenities there is no doubt.

I agree with this, although I have two inch’s hanging on the outside of my girlfriend so I always play with her clit when I’m in her, Partly because sometimes it hurts her If I’m not playing with her. Reason for that Idk I guess the pleasure mixes with the pain? But you got to love that feeling when they start squirming and squeezing and it feels like their gonna rip your dick off.

Erect Length 8.500 inches , Erect Girth5.700 inches, Flaccid Length 5 inches, hang Flaccid Girth 4.2 inches, Erect Width 1.814 inches,

Erect Volume 21.977cubic inches


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