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Ligament ache pain, good or bad?

Here is the link to the full study:
http://144.92.48.140/files/loci/Pro…trinsic2005.pdf

look what it says:
“After a Grade III injury (complete rupture) to ligament, a
region of scar tissue is deposited to provide a provisional
matrix for connecting the two residual ends of the ruptured
tissue (Frank et al., 1983; Jack, 1950). Biochemical analysis
of this scar tissue reveals changes in total collagen and glycosaminoglycan content within the scar
tissue out to 40 weeks post-injury (Frank et al., 1983).
………………
Mechanical evaluation of ligaments after subfailure
injury revealed a substantial strength deficit and increased
deformations within the strain-stiffening toe-region of the
load-deformation, consistent with previous reports (Provenzano
et al., 2002a,b) and indicating a significant tissue
injury. This early portion of the stress–strain curve is
physiologically relevant. Changes in mechanical behavior in
this region indicate a longer functional length prior to load
bearing…

Results herein point toward an intrinsic process of collagenous
ECM remodeling that relies more heavily on
replacing type I collagen directly than producing a predominantly
type III collagen provisional matrix (scar) to be later
replaced by type I collagen.

Furthermore, proteoglycan
mRNA levels indicate significant increases in conjunction
with increased collagen expression. Since proteoglycans
such as decorin, lumican, and fibromodulin are associated
with collagen fibrillogenesis (Birk et al., 1995; Chakravarti
et al., 1998; Ezura et al., 2000; Jepsen et al., 2002; Svensson
et al., 1999; Vogel and Trotter, 1987), as well as cell
behavior (see Kresse and Schonherr, 2001), it appears likely
that they are, at least in part, up-regulated to help modulate
the fibrillogenesis of the newly synthesized collagen…”
http://144.92.48.140/files/loci/Pro…trinsic2005.pdf

According to this link, an Achille’ tendon takes 6 months to fully heal:
http://achillesblog.com/files/2008/…re_mass_gen.pdf

Summint it up, grade II injuries (no inflammation neither scar deposition) are repaired through more ‘healthy’ collagen deposition and new fibers. Being this tissue similar to the normal tissue, it can be elongated again, ‘small’ injuries (grade II) to this tissue will cause new collagen deposition and so on. The whole process can take few weeks. Scar tissue, instead, is less elastic and requires more time to disappear. Without even thinking to the pain, inability to have intercourse etc..

Beside that, how can you pull on your ligs without pulling the penis? And again, stretching ligs would add about nothing to erect length. In penis surgery, where the ligs are cut, there is a gain in EL of about 1/4”; some people don’t report any lenght gains at all from this procedure. If cutting ligs can’t do much, what stretching them can accomplish?

Originally Posted by marinera

Beside that, how can you pull on your ligs without pulling the penis? And again, stretching ligs would add about nothing to erect length. In penis surgery, where the ligs are cut, there is a gain in EL of about 1/4”; some people don’t report any lenght gains at all from this procedure. If cutting ligs can’t do much, what stretching them can accomplish?

This was the argument that won me over.


Keep an open mind and a closed wallet... unless it\'s open to making a donation!

Originally Posted by john.bigson

Im sure there are things i do not know of, like for instance perhaps scar tissue has a tendancy to shrink?

The simplified version is that type III collagen(scar tissue) ‘shrinks’ to draw healing edges together. It is inelastic and has a cross-linked structure (think of reinforced concrete) that stabilises tissue and resists deformation.

How does somebody know if he has scar tissue?


Hanging through the year 2012. Check my log.

If there is a significative amount, I think you should notice a strange shape of your dick, like in Peyronie’ disease.

It is possible that there is a very small amount and you don’t notice, I think. That would cause a tougher penis, all other things being equal.

Originally Posted by firegoat
The simplified version is that type III collagen(scar tissue) ‘shrinks’ to draw healing edges together. It is inelastic and has a cross-linked structure (think of reinforced concrete) that stabilises tissue and resists deformation.

The physician has spoken :) Im guessing type I collagen does not shrink to draw healing edges together?

Originally Posted by marinera
Here is the link to the full study:
http://144.92.48.140/files/loci/Pro…trinsic2005.pdf

According to this link, an Achille’ tendon takes 6 months to fully heal:
http://achillesblog.com/files/2008/…re_mass_gen.pdf

Summint it up, grade II injuries (no inflammation neither scar deposition) are repaired through more ‘healthy’ collagen deposition and new fibers. Being this tissue similar to the normal tissue, it can be elongated again, ‘small’ injuries (grade II) to this tissue will cause new collagen deposition and so on. The whole process can take few weeks. Scar tissue, instead, is less elastic and requires more time to disappear. Without even thinking to the pain, inability to have intercourse etc..

Beside that, how can you pull on your ligs without pulling the penis? And again, stretching ligs would add about nothing to erect length. In penis surgery, where the ligs are cut, there is a gain in EL of about 1/4”; some people don’t report any lenght gains at all from this procedure. If cutting ligs can’t do much, what stretching them can accomplish?

I have read the whole report. And it is logical, as you say, that after grade II sprain has healed it can be elongated again. This should though also be true for a healed (or non healed, if the force is enough) type III collagen dominated repair. Creating gaps in scar tissue would (i assume) cause the body to lay down scar tissue between the scar tissues.
However… i just read that scar tissue is like 10 times stronger than regular ligaments, and logically that would mean that i need 10 times as much force as i had (creating the inflammatory injury) if i wish to keep working in that “region”. Thats NOT practical, since it would probably cause me to crush my glans and other parts.

All in all, even IF there is something to the “hardcore” approach of susp. ligament gains, i feel like there are more arguments in favor of trying to work with the type I collagen response.

How can i pull on ligs without pulling other penis? Well, since i got a slight inflammation in my ligs, but nowhere else in my penis, that is apparently just what i did. The force is concentrated there, due to physical mechanical properties. But thats besides the point.

Anyway, i feel as if i have gotten answers to my questions now and i would like to thank firegoat, mister007 and marinera for discussing and giving me information!

Thank you!


Last edited by john.bigson : 04-03-2012 at .

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