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Libido problems

Obviously there are different views on hard drugs. However, We should not be seen as advocating the use of any ‘social’ drugs.

If we allow recommendation of one drug then it can lead on to more dangerous drugs being recommended. We could be then accused us of promoting the use of drugs. Then with a damaged reputation we lose credibility.

Poppy’s are a natural herb. It also happens Heroin is produced from them.

So the rule is No Recommendations!


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Originally Posted by R Dopa
SSRIs don’t lower sex drive by depleting testosterone, but nobody’s sure how they do.


Orthomolecular people and even some variants believe it comes up to histamine levels and methylization. Histamine polarization would give a credible possibility for why some people can’t cum or not on these types of meds. Different camps as well as the “it works for some reason we don’t know” debate whether it is indirect or direct in nature of causation.

More conventional Ortho books are:

A good ortho book is Treating And Beating Anxiety And Depression: With Orthomolecular Medicine: A Guide For Patients by Rodger H. Murphree . He hates meds deeply, but has plenty of great info on how they and less synthetic solutions work for people.
http://www.drmurphreestore.com/mooddismol.html Kind of like a semi-sample of his work, digested way down.

I also liked another dude in ortho, who wrote a book on the dietary angle as well. people love to pop pills, vitamins, gel caps, and still eat like shit 24/7. This book is older and may have a newer version out though, but has plenty of good data in it.
The Brain Chemistry Diet : The Personalized Prescription for Balancing Mood, Relieving Stress, and Conquering Depression, Based on Your Personality Profile (Hardcover)
by Michael Lesser (Author), Colleen J. Kapklein (Author)

I like buying books used for toilet perusal time. I comb amazon used resellers and ebay for bargains. Check to see if your local library has them too, before you commit to dropping some coin.


“You see, I don’t want to do good things, I want to do great things.” ~Alexander Joseph Luthor

I know Lewd Ferrigno personally.

As far as being off topic, I am not. The original poster was concerned about loss of libido as it relates to the use of antidepressants. I happen to believe that cannabis is a natural antidepressant and it does not cause the loss of libido.

I did not mean to suggest anyone do anything illegal. Marijuana is not illegal everywhere. In fact we are finally opening up to the fact that it has many medicinal properties.

I also concur with what Hap says about stopping the antidepressants suddenly. This can bring about suicidal tendencies in many. That alone says something about the nature of these so-called “safe drugs.” This is a tender spot with me because I have seen this happen in the real world many times. I was not suggesting that reynolds throw out all his Lexapro and replace it with pot. I am not a doctor. However, I do have a right to express my opinion on the subject, and as a rule, people don’t kill themselves when they run out of pot.

I just hate how this country has so readily accepted the use of antidepressants. The doctors and the pharmaceutical companies keep this country sedated for profit, Big Profit. Just because we are getting quieter doesn’t mean that we are getting better.

Also, mgus makes an interesting point. While it may be true that not everyone who takes these drugs have a loss of libido, it has been my experience that most do. At least everyone I know. Paxil seems to be the worst. These pills are not popular because they fix a Serotonin imbalance, they are popular because they induce a mild state of euphoria: a legal high. Antidepressants paint a color of life that does not exist, in reality. Herb does the same thing, without the side effects.

Marinol is a prescription pill, approved by the FDA and available since 1986, that contains synthetic THC …

http://www.pacifier.com/~alive/cmu/…nd_cannabis.htm

Twat also makes an interesting point. I’ll go with a healthy diet vs pills anytime. The problem in this country is we want to fix everything with a pill.


2003: 6X5 2010: 7X7

No Nukes

Originally Posted by Big Girtha
…….
I did not mean to suggest anyone do anything illegal. Marijuana is not illegal everywhere. ……..

Is it in NY? Is it in Texas? :)

I agree with many points of your post, glad to see that you can put yourself in our boots also.

Cheers.

Originally Posted by petitfaun
We should not be seen as advocating the use of any ‘social’ drugs.


Thunder's Place does not ever make any sort of official recommendations. It is a forum. We discuss possibilities. Individual members may contribute what they think, but there is never any official endorsement by this site.

I think that’s clear.

Originally Posted by petitfaun
Obviously there are different views on hard drugs.


tit I don’t think I’ve ever disagreed with you. At least I don’t remember doing so, but I take issue with the way you frame that one.

The only ‘hard drugs’ that have been referred to in this thread are the heroin that everyone seems bent on equating with marijuana, and the anti-depressants themselves.

It’s just not a remotely fair comparison.

Have a look at this chart, for example, that tracks the ill effects of dependence and physical harm. Look where cannabis is and compare it to the other drugs (heroin in particular).

Heroin is a narcotic. Marijuana is not; it is a mild hallucinogen (mainly because of its THC content), and is primarily viewed as a hypnotic by people attempting to realistically classify its psycho-active effects.

It was reclassified as a narcotic in the US, around the time Nancy Reagan got on her “Just say, No” soap box. This reclassification was done as part of the conservative “War on Drugs” effort, ultimately led by Bill Bennett. It’s utter hogwash (politically driven hogwash :) ), as is the assertion the marijuana is a so-called “gateway drug.”

This kind of rhetoric has been called into serious question and has not withstood any sort of serious scrutiny.

Quote
Some claim that trying marijuana increases the probability that users will eventually use harder drugs. This hypothesis has been one of the central pillars of anti-cannabis drug policy in the United States, though the validity and implications of these hypotheses are highly debated.[38] Studies have shown that tobacco smoking is a better predictor of concurrent illicit hard drug use than smoking cannabis.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis_(drug)#Gateway_drug_theory

Big G, I get it.

You were trying to get at the root of reynolds stated problem, so in that regard you weren’t ‘off topic’ per se.

You were however somewhat cavalier with your recommendation. Lexapro is one of the more intense anti-depressants out there; it is rarely prescribed casually.

I have done a fair amount of reading on this subject and have even attended a few lectures at NYU from some of the top Psycho-pharmacologists in the world; I’m not an expert myself, but I do know one or two things.

I’ll tell everyone a little story.

I have a friend who has been on various forms of anti-depressants for many years. She hooked up with a guy that she was head-over-heels about. Trouble was she couldn’t orgasm with him. Her drug was Effexor. After the boyfriend discovered that this could be the problem with her ability to orgasm, he began pestering her to “get off” the drugs - something that she herself had wanted to do anyway. She worked with her therapist, and gradually cut the dosage over the course of a month and a half. We all thought that she had made miraculous progress.

After about two weeks of being anti-depressant free, I received a phone call. She didn’t know where she was. She had driven herself out of the city and was upstate somewhere. She was having a major panic attack and was totally disoriented. After about an hour on the phone with her I got her to tell me about her surroundings.

Long story short, we determined she had checked herself in at some random bed and breakfast up in the Catskills. After locating her, I stayed on the phone and devised a step-by-step plan for her to return, and stayed with her on the phone helping her manage her anxiety as she drove the 2 hours back to the city. She made it back to New York, and immediately went to her Psychiatrist, who promptly restored her medications. Even with that, it took her well over a month before she was back to normal.

The point is, although one anti-depressant may have fewer side-effects overall, this doesn’t mean it’s easy, or appropriate to change them. Even if you do everything right, the repercussions of switching meds are often serious business. We’re talking brain chemistry here.

With regard to taking hormones… again, self-medicating is a slippery slope. If you have serious enough issues to warrant the prescription of mood altering drugs in the first place you should be very careful about what you throw into the mix of your body chemistry.

Therefore we must all be cautious with our ‘advice.’

Make sense?

Therefore I will reassert that reynolds talk seriously with his doctor and his therapist about the problems he is having and work out a responsible course of action to address it. You could bring this up, reynolds:

Quote
The Brain Chemistry Diet : The Personalized Prescription for Balancing Mood, Relieving Stress, and Conquering Depression, Based on Your Personality Profile (Hardcover)
by Michael Lesser (Author), Colleen J. Kapklein (Author)

But let’s not get crazy with testosterone creams, okay?


Before: I'd like to show you something I'm very proud of, but you'll have to move real close.

After: I\'d like to show you something I\'m very proud of, but you guys in the front row will have to stand back.

God gave men both a penis and a brain, but unfortunately not enough blood supply to run both at the same time. - Robin Williams (:

Was it the SSRI or the pumping and stretching that caused the trouble? SSRIs can lower libido and make it difficult to orgasm, but it doesn’t always reduce arousal ability.


Pussy Pounder

Good point, Pounder.

We all got so caught up in the drug angle that we forgot that it could be the PE.

This could just be a negative PI of over stressing the unit.

Good post. :thumbs:


Before: I'd like to show you something I'm very proud of, but you'll have to move real close.

After: I\'d like to show you something I\'m very proud of, but you guys in the front row will have to stand back.

God gave men both a penis and a brain, but unfortunately not enough blood supply to run both at the same time. - Robin Williams (:

Thanks Mr. Happy :)


Pussy Pounder

Somewhat off-topic clarification:

Originally Posted by Big Girtha
Marijuana is not illegal everywhere. In fact we are finally opening up to the fact that it has many medicinal properties.


Personally, I see no reason why THC shouldn’t be used in medical treatment if it has an effect - after all, opiates are.

Originally Posted by Big Girtha
Also, mgus makes an interesting point. While it may be true that not everyone who takes these drugs have a loss of libido, it has been my experience that most do. At least everyone I know. Paxil seems to be the worst. These pills are not popular because they fix a Serotonin imbalance, they are popular because they induce a mild state of euphoria: a legal high. Antidepressants paint a color of life that does not exist, in reality.


The last sentences are not entirely true.

In “The Happiness Hypothesis” Jonathan Haidt reviews the three proven ways to improve (raise) your base-line positivity (what is your general happiness level in life): Meditation, Cognitive Behavioural Therapy and SSRI’s. There are studies where the subjects test their base-line positivity and then it is reassessed after a while on Paxil - and the general outlook on life is raised, base-line positivity is increased. Note that the base-line positivity might start at a low, and get raised to “average”. Not a color of life that does not exist, just the same color as everyone else experiences.

When it comes to those that already have a high base-line positivity, I don’t know what the effects are - most likely those never wind up taking SSRI’s, no need to.

When it comes to the chemistry discussion and serotonin, the doc that Twat refers to makes a valid point - if you have almost no serotonin to start with, then it makes more sense to add some instead of taking a drug to make allow the serotonin to bounce around a few times extra. Then again, healthy diet might not cut it, due to the way the various amino acids “compete for space” to keep a certain balance in the system. The only way of getting past the body’s set balancing system is to take 5-HTP, which is converted to serotonin without any competition. So you wind up taking a pill anyway - sure it made of the stem of a plant, but nevertheless it is not “a balance diet”. Some people may well have a slightly offset balance - they eat healthily, yet don’t get enough serotonin in their brains anyway. That is when you wind up taking SSRI’s to allow what is up there to bounce around a little extra OR take a different pill, to get the stuff up there directly.

But the notion that SSRI’s paint a color that isn’t there is not true. At least not for those that start out with a lower than average base-line positivity level.


regards, mgus

Taped onto the dashboard of a car at a junkyard, I once found the following: "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." The car was crashed.

Primary goal: To have an EQ above average (i.e. streetsmart, compassionate about life and happy) Secondary goal: to make an anagram of my signature denoting how I feel about my gains

Just to stray off-topic even further, I did smoke some pot that made me limp. I bought a bag from a friend of a friend many years ago and the wife and I decided to spend the weekend out of town at her folk’s place. It was a secluded place out in the woods and it was just us two. We smoked a bowl, got down to business, and Mr. Johnson just didn’t want to play. Come to find out this new batch was the culprit.

This never happened to any pot since.

And another point I wanted to make; if we are going to start censoring people here for recommending drugs, we may as well shut down and delete the “Closing down all the generic drug web sites/and finding open sites for generic drugs” thread.


If girth is king, why the hell does everyone keep talking about length?

WC,

There is a fine line between sharing experiences doing illegal stuff and recommending doing illegal stuff.


regards, mgus

Taped onto the dashboard of a car at a junkyard, I once found the following: "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." The car was crashed.

Primary goal: To have an EQ above average (i.e. streetsmart, compassionate about life and happy) Secondary goal: to make an anagram of my signature denoting how I feel about my gains

That, I agree with.


If girth is king, why the hell does everyone keep talking about length?

Hap. I don’t think we disagree rather we have different views. My reference there was that we have different views of hard drugs than then ‘soft social’ drugs.

(But I’m opposed to them whatever.)

My opposition to the discussison of actively taking any drugs, is that if someone says ‘They suggested taking drugs’ - That could be damaging. because it is easily mis-interpreted


Don't be a lurker left out in the cold. :lurk: Join the happy band of donors!

Psst! The link is at the bottom of the page :bigwink:

Okay, tit. I don’t quite understand the distinction, but I’m with you in spirit. :)

It is interesting that on the chart that tracks mean dependence and physical harm, cannabis scores lower in both categories than either tobacco or alcohol (those so-called ‘soft social’ drugs you mention). It should also be noted that the physical harm index would be even lower for cannabis if the standard consumption were not smoking. The act of smoking itself is a large part of the physical harm component for it. Vaporization or use in cooking is thought to obviate the majority of physical harm associated with it for example.

The human body just isn’t designed to take in hot ash, so any drug that is consumed that way has that working against it.

Originally Posted by mgus
There is a fine line between sharing experiences doing illegal stuff and recommending doing illegal stuff.


I disagree; I think such differences are delineated by very clear lines. Probably in bold.

However, I also think that when the discussion is conversational that sometimes the tone can shift in ways that are not intended.

Being an advocate for alternative sorts of healing is not out of bounds here, as long as it is clear that Thunder's Place in no way endorses illegal activity.

Thunder's Place does endorse discussion, however. :leftie:

Originally Posted by mgus
Not a color of life that does not exist, just the same color as everyone else experiences.


Regardless of base-line indicators, this is an utterly unprovable statement.

Much the same as the Big G’s:

Originally Posted by Big Girtha
Antidepressants paint a color of life that does not exist, in reality.


We have know way of knowing.

We can only see similarities, some of which we can measure, but we shouldn’t confuse that data with what an individual experiences. That is getting into mystery of life territory. We can’t know that everyone experiences the color blue in the same way, we can only know that there are certain indicators that we all identify as the color blue. Still, on an individual level, my blue could be your red and we’d have no way to finally ‘know’.

So has reynolds got so thoroughly disgusted with his thread that he isn’t coming back?

Anybody else want to comment on his idea about the use of topical steroids?


Before: I'd like to show you something I'm very proud of, but you'll have to move real close.

After: I\'d like to show you something I\'m very proud of, but you guys in the front row will have to stand back.

God gave men both a penis and a brain, but unfortunately not enough blood supply to run both at the same time. - Robin Williams (:

Hap,

I understood BG to use the concept of “color of life” to mean experience life, not to actual color experiences. Since we are talking about anti-depressants I made the comparison to base-line positivity. Which is about as provable as things get in the psych field.


regards, mgus

Taped onto the dashboard of a car at a junkyard, I once found the following: "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." The car was crashed.

Primary goal: To have an EQ above average (i.e. streetsmart, compassionate about life and happy) Secondary goal: to make an anagram of my signature denoting how I feel about my gains

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