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Dick Control: A Primer

Thanks a lot for the tip, cheeva. Just need to clear out the rest. When I just started learning about kegels (locating th PC muscle, etc.) the exercise was basically to hold ones urine flow while urinating. From what I have read from this thread the pushing kegel is supposed to stop the urine flow and the pulling kegel isn’t supposed to affect it at all. Is that correct?

When attempting to perform the pulling kegel, I do what you say, and feel a pressure in the tail bone and the contraction seems to be more powerful in the anus area, not at the beginning of the shaft and in the front area like when doing a pushing kegel. Is that right too?

I’m really interested in dry orgasms, thats why I really want to master this pulling kegel thing. I have read the book “the multi-orgasmic man”, however I don’t remember the author mentioning those different kegel variations. She mentioned the “slamming on the PC muscle”, like sort of pulling the hand brake in a car, right before the PONR. This made it all a bit confusing about which kegel is what. So anyways, reading the book made me attempt the dry orgasm and I was slamming the PC muscle right before the PONR using what I’m calling here the pushing kegel (didn’t know the pulling one existed at all), then the BC contractions came, and no sperm. However afterwards the erection got much “soggier” I could feel that I didn’t have much of “energy” at all. I guess I ejaculated in the bladder. So obviously I was doing something wrong. Want to get back on track with the whole dry orgasm thing. If you have time, I would greatly appreciate some comment of yours on the subject.

Hopefully I didn’t confuse you too much, cheeva. I am going to keep trying to master the pulling kegel, just started 2 weeks ago and have been doing the spreading exercise a couple of times now for a couple of weeks. Haven’t ejaculated any of the times. So thats on track.

Thanks a lot again!

A bit of editing now. I have been trying to do the pulling kegel yesterday night while urinating, and realized that I’m doing it wrong. :( The urine flow stops completely. And so I have reread the thread again, discovered that performing a pulling kegel is like trying to increase the urine flow while urinating. Hope that this time I’m right.

I tried it this morning and it seemed like it’s not even much of a flex, it’s more like you are trying to push on your pelvic muscles from within. It’s difficult however to concentrate on involving only the pelvic muscles. The abs flex as well..

Well, please let me know if I’m completely off the track..
Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by Bugs Bunny
I have a widened exterior sphincter from prostate massaging but have still managed to keep my internal sphincter tight. When I perform a kegel, super pulling, I can feel the internal immediately flex but the external weakly if at all flexes. I am kind of self conscious about it, well I am, I want my girlfriend to see a tight ass if she decides to go exploring down there with her tongue or fingers. Is there any technique that really isolates that muscle and can essentially tone it down to a smaller size? I was thinking of a small anal bead with string attached; I would pull the bead out while squeezing/pulling the sphincter muscles…try providing resistance maybe? Anyway I have now reached the point where I can Internal Lock right before PONR and receive a slight orgasm with a small bit of semenal fluid escaping my penis… I don’t lose my entire erection or libido/energy… it goes down to an 80% which I can quickly work back up and do the process over again. So the Kegels are working. Are there any better methods of developing that muscle which strenghtens your erections/bloodflow/and ultimately regulates what goes down the shaft and what doesn’t. Kegels with weights, or maybe even in certain positions like kneeling versus standing.

Thanks again Siddhartha

-Bugs


I don’t have much experience with using props for these exercises. I think you can get all the strength and tone you need in your lower abdomen/genital region from just using the internal methods outlined in this thread. But if you want to drape a towel over your dick when doing erect kegels, or maybe try holding a small object in your anus to strengthen your outer sphincter, go for it! :)

I would recommend just continuing to practice doing strong, long held pulling kegels. When you flex, focus on pulling your tailbone inward and then swirling it around. This will engage your outer sphincter. And once you’ve clenched as hard as you can, clench harder.

Originally Posted by serge_89
Thanks a lot for the tip, cheeva. Just need to clear out the rest. When I just started learning about kegels (locating th PC muscle, etc.) the exercise was basically to hold ones urine flow while urinating. From what I have read from this thread the pushing kegel is supposed to stop the urine flow and the pulling kegel isn’t supposed to affect it at all. Is that correct?

When attempting to perform the pulling kegel, I do what you say, and feel a pressure in the tail bone and the contraction seems to be more powerful in the anus area, not at the beginning of the shaft and in the front area like when doing a pushing kegel. Is that right too?

I’m really interested in dry orgasms, thats why I really want to master this pulling kegel thing. I have read the book “the multi-orgasmic man”, however I don’t remember the author mentioning those different kegel variations. She mentioned the “slamming on the PC muscle”, like sort of pulling the hand brake in a car, right before the PONR. This made it all a bit confusing about which kegel is what. So anyways, reading the book made me attempt the dry orgasm and I was slamming the PC muscle right before the PONR using what I’m calling here the pushing kegel (didn’t know the pulling one existed at all), then the BC contractions came, and no sperm. However afterwards the erection got much “soggier” I could feel that I didn’t have much of “energy” at all. I guess I ejaculated in the bladder. So obviously I was doing something wrong. Want to get back on track with the whole dry orgasm thing. If you have time, I would greatly appreciate some comment of yours on the subject.

Hopefully I didn’t confuse you too much, cheeva. I am going to keep trying to master the pulling kegel, just started 2 weeks ago and have been doing the spreading exercise a couple of times now for a couple of weeks. Haven’t ejaculated any of the times. So thats on track.

Thanks a lot again!

A bit of editing now. I have been trying to do the pulling kegel yesterday night while urinating, and realized that I’m doing it wrong. The urine flow stops completely. And so I have reread the thread again, discovered that performing a pulling kegel is like trying to increase the urine flow while urinating. Hope that this time I’m right.

I tried it this morning and it seemed like it’s not even much of a flex, it’s more like you are trying to push on your pelvic muscles from within. It’s difficult however to concentrate on involving only the pelvic muscles. The abs flex as well..

Well, please let me know if I’m completely off the track..
Thanks a lot.

It sounds like you are confusing pulling kegels with reverse kegels. I made up the terms “pulling kegels” and “pushing kegels” in order to have a way of explaining these exercises. I hope in doing so I have not made things unnecessarily confusing. I call these exercises kegels (or variations on kegels) because they do engage the BC/PC muscle. But in addition, they activate other surrounding muscles in the pelvic floor. The main insight I hope people take away from these distinctions between pushing and pulling is the importance of understanding and mastering the direction of force of the contractions. In these exercises you are not isolating individual muscles, so it’s quite alright to engage your abs as well. The best way I think is just to focus on how various muscle groups respond to the contractions. Notice how your abs engage differently when the direction of force is reversed (pushing vs. pulling.) I notice that my lower abs tighten up spontaneously when I do pushing kegels, but stay relatively relaxed with pulling kegels (but my lower back muscles engage actively when pulling.)

Stopping the flow of urine is simply a way of isolating the BC muscle. Once you’ve done that, you don’t need to worry about it any more—you know where the muscle is. (But for the record, a pushing or pulling kegel will stop the flow of urine, since both involve contracting the BC/PC muscles.)

I will try to clarify:

Pushing kegels are most similar to ordinary kegels. This is perhaps why many men report that kegels don’t help them hold back from ejaculation, and in fact often push them over the edge. The reason for this is that the standard kegel, when done erect, directs the force of the contractions into the penis. If you do short, quick kegels with a strong erection (causing your penis to bob up and down), you are virtually imitating the involuntary muscle contractions associated with ejaculation. If you do this while also stimulating yourself, you can push yourself over the edge very quickly. Strong, long held pushing kegels (consciously accentuating the force of the contraction going into the penis) will cause the glans to expand and can be extremely pleasurable. This can be cultivated to the point of being able to perform “no hands” masturbation. So pushing kegels are used for ramping up arousal. They are essentially strong, long held kegels that simply highlight the natural tendency of the contraction to send pleasurable nerve responses into the body of the penis and cause the glans to expand.

If you try and stop yourself from ejaculating by holding a strong pushing kegel right at the PONR, you might find that the involuntary contraction begin to blend in with your clench and you are pushed over the edge (or that some semen escaped into the urethra and/or is sent back into the bladder. Again, this is because pushing kegels are stimulating to both the shaft and glans. You are pushing blood into the glans as well as sending pleasurable nerve signals into the penis while simulating the types of contractions that are associated with orgasm. So pushing kegels don’t make a very good “lock” when you are close to the PONR.

Pulling kegels are also strong contractions of the muscles of the pelvic floor (including the BC/PC), but with the focus of the contraction being on the anal sphincters. This causes nerve stimulation (or “energy”) to be pulled away from the penis and is very useful (if not essential) in short-circuiting the ejaculation response right at the PONR. Pulling kegels bring genital arousal levels down. Pulling kegels are a great “lock” when you are close to the PONR because while you are tightly clenching the BC/PC muscles you are also pulling blood and nerve signals away from the penis.

Revers Kegels the exercise that you can isolate by trying to make your stream of urine stronger. Reverse kegels are not a “lock.” In fact, they’re the reverse of a lock—in a strong, long held reverse kegel you are holding the urethra wide open. At high levels of arousal you can actually push semen into your urethra, then up and out without having an orgasm (or just a very mild one.) Reverse kegels are used in “ballooning” and can be a great tool for learning the intricacies of your own arousal potential, but they are not essential to semen retention, dry orgasm, or basic dick control. They can be a lot of fun though, and are greet if you are trying to master long drawn out orgasms where it doesn’t matter if you ejaculate or not, or where you ejaculate several times (multiple “wet” orgasms.) Basically they’re good for ramping up arousal, “ballooning” the glans of the penis, and for controlled ejaculation.

I hope this clarifies some things.

Good luck to both of you, and please do stick with it!

EDIT: Oh, one more note to both of you (and anyone else interested in “dry orgasms”): There is still a refractory period even after a dry orgasm, so don’t think you’re doing something wrong if your arousal level goes down for awhile after a dry orgasm. Also, “energy levels” are not defined by how overtly aroused you are in your genital region. When arousal is dispersed throughout your body, it will feel more balanced and calm. You lose your erection because energy has moved elsewhere. Normally it would have moved out, but in the case you’ve just rearranged it so that it’s more evenly distributed in your body. What this means though is that you can very easily redirect that energy back into your genital region if and when you wish. That energy is still available to you. But there is still a window where it need to recirculate. Does that make sense?


Last edited by cheeva : 01-17-2009 at .

Thanks for the tip cheeva. I guess that explains my temporarily decreased erection.


Breathe

Hi cheeva,

First of all, I think your posts in this thread and around this site are generally priceless.

I was wondering if you might have the wherewithall to name the specific muscles involved with each type of kegel and direction. Perhaps a little communication between us on the side and we can figure it out. I studied anatomy and physiology among other related subjects, and I guess for me it would be very helpful to be able to identify exactly which muscle or set of muscles to contract and go from there. Might be helpful to others too, if we could identify the muscles.

Just a thought. I appreciate the great effort you have gone through to help others understand what you are describing.

I know that other threads have pictures of the male anatomy with labels, and many have tried to explain the difference between PC and BC muscles. I suspect that us men may have learned different ways to stop the flow of urine, and may be unable to decouple the PC from the BC set. I thought I knew the difference until a few weeks ago when reading a thread about kegeling while stretching out my flaccid penis. After a few days, I was able to differentiate the set of muscles, and that helped a lot.

Your thoughts?


(12/5/2008) BPEL: 7.75" EG: 5.75" BSFL: 8.1" FL: 5" FG 4.25"||New Goal: NBPEL: 8" EG: 6"

Technique: 95% Wet Jelqing, 5% Low Vacuum Pumping

Photos Journal

Pubococogeus.
Bucococgeous.

If you can squeeze both BC and PC at the same time it makes for really huge wood. The kind the has ribs, ribs that breathe that is, hehehehe!


Speak softly carry a big dick, I'm mean stick!

Thank you SO much, cheeva! Your explanation just cleared everything out for me 100%! REALLY helped me..

Thanks again.

Originally Posted by kingpole
Pubococogeus.
Bucococgeous.

If you can squeeze both BC and PC at the same time it makes for really huge wood. The kind the has ribs, ribs that breathe that is, hehehehe!

There are more muscles down there than those. What about the following?

Coccygeus
Levator ani
Iliococcygeus
Puborectalis
Sphincter ani externus
Sphincter ani internus


(12/5/2008) BPEL: 7.75" EG: 5.75" BSFL: 8.1" FL: 5" FG 4.25"||New Goal: NBPEL: 8" EG: 6"

Technique: 95% Wet Jelqing, 5% Low Vacuum Pumping

Photos Journal

BFLR, it’s not a bad idea. All of the muscles you listed above are involved in the exercises outlined in this thread—particularly the Super Pushing and Pulling Kegels and the Great Seal.

Other muscles include the gluteus maximus and the lower abdominal muscles, as well as the muscle tissue surrounding the coccyx, prostate and urethra and perhaps even the bladder (interesting link here: “A description of two Muscles surrounding the membranous part of the Urethra”.)

Please feel free to share any insight or anatomical knowledge you have.


Last edited by cheeva : 01-19-2009 at .

[QUOTE=BigFatLuvRocket]
There are more muscles down there than those. What about the following?

Coccygeus
Levator ani
Iliococcygeus
Puborectalis
Sphincter ani externus
Sphincter

Yeah I know but if you do a combination of BC/PC and squeeze you glutes a bit you basically engage all of them. This is why older guys need to have sex or jerk off several times a week to keep the pelvic floor muscles strong. Now thrust it, hehehehe!


Speak softly carry a big dick, I'm mean stick!

The stronger the contraction, the more surrounding muscles become engaged. We want to strenghen and gain mastery of all the muscles in the pelvic floor. Focusing the center of the contraction on the levitor ani and/or sphincter muscles (the largest muscles of the pelvic floor) will lead to far greater strength and control than merely trying to isolate the BC/PC muscles. (Although isolating those muscles is important as well.)

Puborectalis.

I think a big part of what’s involved in the “pulling” kegels and the “great seal,” and the short-circuiting of ejaculation at the PONR, has to with the sacral nerve. When you “pull” while focusing your contraction on the sphincter region and coccyx, the sacral nerve innervates the muscles in an inward direction. (I confess that I don’t really know what I’m talking about here—just trying to overlay experience and sensation with a very rudimentary understanding of anatomy and physiology. Experts please clarify or correct! :) )

I think something similar goes on with the pudendal nerve.


Last edited by cheeva : 01-19-2009 at .

Originally Posted by serge_89
Thank you SO much, cheeva! Your explanation just cleared everything out for me 100%! REALLY helped me..

Thanks again.

“Cleared everything out?” Hmmm. Some kegeling!

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