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I dont want to argue so I will quit posting here.

“Bro, test and DHT are different hormones that exhibit different methods of action. Period. End of story. This is basic first year stuff. “

Bro, DHT and T act on the same receptor. This is a fact.


Mr jones and me..... Gonna be big stars

Quote
Originally posted by Cya at 8
“So at least as far as muscle is concerned, testosterone is the primary active androgen. This is not to say that administering exogenous DHT is not without any anabolic effect. It actually does have some anabolic activity in the muscle, albeit significantly weaker than that of an equal amount of testosterone. This is due to its quick breakdown by 3a-HSD into the weak metabolite 5alpha-androstan-3a,17b-diol. If this enzyme were somehow blocked, it is likely that DHT would exhibit very potent anabolic effects on muscle.”

This is another “opinion.”

http://www.musclemonthly.com/print/…estosterone.htm

Nice article by Pat. He created 4ad by the way.

Why don’t you write him and ask him his opinion regarding DHT ability to promote anabolism.

I’d love to see a guy like that chime in….

Quote
Originally posted by Jones8315
“Bro, test and DHT are different hormones that exhibit different methods of action. Period. End of story. This is basic first year stuff. “

Bro, DHT and T act on the same receptor. This is a fact.

SO? What’s your point?

So do Oxymetholone, Oxandrolone, Nandrolone, Trenbolone, Methenolone and a whole slew of other hormones.

Do you think that all of them have the same method of action or have the same metabolic pathways once they reach the AR???

Dude, I’m just trying to show you that using a DHT precursor SHOULD be a lot more effective than using a Testosterone precursor that you then have to content with conversion to DHT.

DO you want to argue that it’s test and not DHT that could potentially trigger growth?

I’m not sure why you’re even arguing about this.

“Bro, test and DHT are different hormones that exhibit different methods of action. Period. End of story. This is basic first year stuff. “

“Dihydrotestosterone binds the androgen receptor much more strongly than does testosterone at the same concentration, yielding a higher degree of ligand-receptor stability. When the concentration of testosterone is increased however, the receptor stability increases to a level similar to that seen with dihydrotestosterone (10)”

nearlythere has posted both of these. I find it interesting that he denies they T and DHT have the same mechanism, but posts literature stating they share the same receptor and simply have different affinities. I find this very interesting.


Mr jones and me..... Gonna be big stars

Quote
Originally posted by Jones8315
“Bro, test and DHT are different hormones that exhibit different methods of action. Period. End of story. This is basic first year stuff. “

“Dihydrotestosterone binds the androgen receptor much more strongly than does testosterone at the same concentration, yielding a higher degree of ligand-receptor stability. When the concentration of testosterone is increased however, the receptor stability increases to a level similar to that seen with dihydrotestosterone (10)”

nearlythere has posted both of these. I find it interesting that he denies they T and DHT have the same mechanism, but posts literature stating they share the same receptor and simply have different affinities. I find this very interesting.

They don’t contradict one another.

DHT binds to the AR, as does Test. With a very high concentration of test, the bond becomes as stable as DHT.

Don’t confuse AR stability with methods of action.

Simple as that. Yeah, when you introduce huge doses of Test it will bind as strongly to the AR as does DHT. They still do completely different things though…

Apples and oranges kid.

Quote
Originally posted by nearlythere
Dude, I'm just trying to show you that using a DHT precursor SHOULD be a lot more effective than using a Testosterone precursor that you then have to content with conversion to DHT.

DO you want to argue that it's test and not DHT that could potentially trigger growth?

I'm not sure why you're even arguing about this.

DHT was more successful in treating micropenis. We use a test precursor because there is so much 5AR in the penis that it gets converted almost immediately.


Mr jones and me..... Gonna be big stars

Jones -

Just post a link to ONE medical study that shows test and DHT have the same effect in humans and I’ll let it die.

Just one kid.

ONE!

Quote
Originally posted by Jones8315
DHT was more successful in treating micropenis. We use a test precursor because there is so much 5AR in the penis that it gets converted almost immediately.

Sorry. BS.

PROVE IT!

One study that shows how much 5AR in a human penis and ANY info on rate limiting conversion.

ONE!

Quote
Originally posted by Jones8315
DHT was more successful in treating micropenis.

Quote
Originally posted by Jones8315
We use a test precursor

Why?

Why not use the already proven successful DHT?

(your words, not mine…)

DHT is a controlled substance. Did you know that?


Mr jones and me..... Gonna be big stars

Quote
Originally posted by nearlythere
They don't contradict one another.

DHT binds to the AR, as does Test. With a very high concentration of test, the bond becomes as stable as DHT.

Don't confuse AR stability with methods of action.

Simple as that. Yeah, when you introduce huge doses of Test it will bind as strongly to the AR as does DHT. They still do completely different things though…

Apples and oranges kid.

“bond becomes stable as DHT” ??? That makes no sense. Here is an analogy so you can understand ligand specific androgen activation through the electrostatic interactions with an ezyme:

A house is a cell. The lock is the receptor. To get in, you have two keys that randomly poke at the door. T is rusty key. DHT is a well lubed key. With random actions, which key will get in more times? DHT will. They both open the SAME door.


Mr jones and me..... Gonna be big stars

Quote
Originally posted by nearlythere
Sorry. BS.

PROVE IT!

One study that shows how much 5AR in a human penis and ANY info on rate limiting conversion.

ONE!

If the were no 5AR in the penis, then how would the penis have developed in the first place? Did we not agree that it is crucial for growth. Sigh.


Mr jones and me..... Gonna be big stars

Quote
Originally posted by Jones8315
DHT is a controlled substance. Did you know that?

Ya.

But DHT precursors are not.

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