carbs, fats, and proteins

2in,

I don´t eat, I´m a “breatharian”… ;-)

Kidding. I begun a little more than a year ago to reduce the pasta, bread, oat and rice stuff (intuitevely) and quickly begun to get better health.

Started to read about various “radicall” diets and desided to get rid of all processed carbs and diary, result… even better health.

I eat;

more and more veggies, a little less fruits and try to pick low GI fruits except when filling up the tank after workout, then I eat plenty sweet fruits direct after training.

I also eat organic eggs and a mix of raw and cooked fish.
Just now I´m in a period where I try to be very “raw”, and dont “cheat”with cooked food more than once or twice a week.

I believe it´s possible to do on very low energy intake IF you practice the “timing” aspect. I guess I consume 50% of my daily intake within three hours or so after workout.

Oh… a lot of avocados and olives I should mention.

I did eat the “normal” athlete diet for many years (15 or so) but feel a lot better on this new thing. All those cooked starches did nothing for me except making me sick, it´s all a myth and people are afraid of trying new things IMO. Or the other way around, people are afraid of going back to our genetically correct diet :-)

/Pan

I have been working towards a macrobiotic diet just for the h*ll of it, and I can tell a difference. This diet is almost all rice and miso, but I wanted to experiment with it. I think you have a super diet- wish mine was that good.

Actually a lot of doctors and scientists are waking up to the reality. That is why it is really being studied now.

The whole fat thing was based on a lie - its was hydrogented fat that caused the problem in that initial study and what was used to make the initial recommendations against reduced saturated fat consumption.

Its all economics really. Hydrogented fats have a very long shelf life and vegetable fats are very cheap to produce.

You can’t make money using natural foods the same way you can with processed foods. They go bad much faster and are more expensive to produce.

This whole economic reality (it really is a problem - I admit it) is the real problem. Also, there may be many people liable for gross health damages with these recommendations.

This is not just - oh try this diet. The high carb diet, as taught here and other places (coupled with low saturated fat intake) causes many problems among them cancer, osteoporosis, autoimmune diseases, obesity, diabetes 2 ( and maybe 1 as grain is suspected of caused the immune system to malfunction and attack the beta cells - however this may not be true) and deficiency problems.

So, you have a diet being recommended by the giovernment that is killing prople (obviously as we have upped our carbs and lowered saturated fat) and that is making food processors rich.

There are a lot of very strong forces that are preventing this from being properly explored ie, from not operating from a base that saturated fat is bad - based on a super flawed study and the apparent whim of some congressmen.

Economics + Stupidity = something doifficult to go against but that is changing as we reach a breaking point and people in mass begin to really look at the facts.

So I think the economics and “habit” will lose as although science can be manipulated, it stands less a chance of this with many eyes a watchin’

Personally, I eat a little rice my self and sometimes some tubers and fruits but I keep it to a minimum. This little amounts of carbs, even though high glycemic, doesn’t give me any problems like breads and pasta use too (even though pasta is low glycemic). Part of the equation is not just the G.I, but how much carb something contains. I like veggies best. They have low carb and much fiber and vitamins. Personally, for me, it was increase consumption of eggs and grass fed beef with fat intact that really made me feel well. I was never really overweight by more than 20 lbs here and there (well, for a short period I did gain some weight) My problem mainly was that I was just always exhausted and probably headed for type 2 diabetes. Even though no carb diets are found in nature, I think I do better with a little carb (starch).

Interestingly, price found no complete vegetarians in his primitive studies, and the peoples who consumed the most grain (still very low by our standards) had the worst health.

The peoples who consumed fish as the stable meat had the best health. But this was closely follwed by the raw dairy eaters and totla meat eaters.

Guys,

I catched about 10-20 small colds a year before,

now I havent had a cold for a year :-)

I think this have to do with many things but mostly the grain, cooked starches and such.

Now if I eat for example a big prtion of whitle bread, I get a SICK feeling within hours. The feeling is like when you are going to get sick with a fever. It dissapears after 10-20 hours or so.
I strongly suspect that it is my immune system that gets a real sidekick from the “anti nutrients” in the wheat.

I had this feeling even before but now I can really put my finger on it.

To bad I rally LOVE bread with cheese and a cup of hot choclate.
BUT….I am strong and my health is more important than satisfying my mouth, so I dont eat it :-)

There is other thing in life that gives satisfaction… you know that don´t you ;-)

/Pan

All sounds very interesting. I have always been interested in the subject. I think I will pick up those books from Amazon and give this topic more consideration. Thanks for the imput.

Newbie, don’t get so riled up sometimes. The frustration shows in your writing and it makes the reader not want to proceed. It’s much better to thoroughly prove your points and let the facts be your attitude. Just my 2 cents. You guys have reinvigorated my interest in this topic!

Ok, I’ll take your advice.

Sorry If I offended anyone.

I will mention some things that got better when I changed my diet;

-Better eye sight, both 3d/focus and also color perception, colors became stronger and more beatiful.

-Better sences in my skin, could feel the wind on my skin and in my hair in another way.

-A lil better erections and sensation.

-Better strength and “explosivity”, felt like a olympic runner the first time a went jogging “raw”.

-Better hearing.

-A better fatbalance in/on my body (IMO) dropped from “I dont know exactly” to ca11%. Lost 6-7lbs in a week, and stayed there.
Now slowly gaining weight due to weightlifting 3-4 times/week.
(Always done that but a lil more into it now.

-A flatter stomach with less “dirt” in the colon.
Less food within the colon, but also (probably) less dirt, poisons and BACTERIA.

-Mental more clear and sharp with better short term memory, normally more happy. All this demands that my blodglucose is right, but I still have some problems with that, which makes me moody and low several times/week.
However, when I have my good days/moments I feel like nothing is impossible and I could achive anything, no fears just balance harmony and happines.

One thing is shure, even though I do not know exactly how my diet will look in a year, I will never go back!

/Pan

2in2002,

Just a few points.

“The belief is that high levels of uric acid from over-consumption of protein are causing musculo-skeletal problems, not carbohydrate.”

More correctly, urea is the chief nitrogenous waste of mammals and most of this waste comes from the breakdown of amino acids. Humans excrete a second nitrogenous waste, uric acid. It is the product of nucleic acid, not protein, metabolism.

Meat products tend to be acidic but so are carbs.

“ I have yet to see a published study on this yet, however, as most of the professional journals are taxed to keep up with the current research.”

Too many research grants are wasted on frivolous case studies. Newbie has pretty much addressed the state of affairs with respect to the “system” we TRUST to guide/ feed/ heal us.

“We can always pick out an exception to everything, including the Zulu. If this was the ideal diet my guess is that over the centuries the world would have naturally moved towards his type of diet, as I think we do have a natural instinct, just like other animals, to do what is best to be the fittest to survive.”

Actually, human nature dictates that people will do what is easiest not what is ideal. Why else are junk food companies reaping huge profits.

BTW, soy beans are a very allergenic food that causes hormonal problems in both sexes. I have abandoned this food as a source of protein as I find the whole vegetarian route to obtaining protein to be futile at times and detrimental to lean tissue. Besides different people have different tolerances for different foods.

I’ll be waiting for your comments on the web site.

Newbie,

I was freaking out for a time on this and the previous thread because you were taking the words right out of my mouth. You are like my long lost, demented, twin brother. I mean this in the coolest sense. Check out the website I posted if you already haven’t.
I m going to look up the books you mentioned. Thanks!

Lastly, what the hell is with you guys? Did you go to secretarial school or something? I can’t keep up with you speed typists! No sooner than I read something four or five more posts appear.

Pan,

Right on. Its about discipline. Let the weak willed ones stuff themselves with candy bars, potato chips, sodas and pastries while we enjoy the finer pleasures of life!

“A flatter stomach with less “dirt” in the colon.”

There is NO going back! There have never been truer words.

Great thread so far. Take it easy guys,

TORSO

Hey Torso - thanks for the kind words. I do the best I can with my typing but my spelling really does suffer for it (lol).

I’m familiar with Dr Mercola (and Rosedale). Its amazing what happens to the body when hormones get unbalanced and the body struggles to maintain a balance through corruption of other hormones.

I didn’t mention soy but you are right - soy is just loaded with bad stuff. The processing alone makes it unfit to eat but them you have high phytates and a bunch of other nasties that are probably much worse than phytates…

Here is a link:

Soy Alert!

There are many anti-soy sites around now.

Soy is another big pushed processed food. Very cheap = high profits. Soy was traditionally consumed in very small amounts in Japan and usually fermented. Soybeans were originally use to fix nitrogen in soil - it was only when fermentation was learned was it consumed.

Fermented soy might be ok - miso and such have many antinutrients that are destroyed. Fermented foods in general have a lot of good things going for them. I had a problem with cows milk when I was little so I was switched to soy formula and soy just has been a problem for me since. I’m probably a little allergic to it in terms of a delayed allergic reaction as when I eat it it tears up my insides. So I’m a little biased but everything I’ve read about soy lately has been bad - even coming out of Japan.

Here is another more specific link:

Soy Alert!

Same basic stuff I have seen in other articles. The guy works mostly with diabetics- and his diet for them is pretty much the prescribed diet for any diabetic. His information MAY be applicable to most people predisposed to diabetes, but I still don’t see the leap from “well, I have these patients” to “carbohydrate is responsible for everyone becoming diabetic and dying early”. You guys can eat tons of fat and believe in your conspiracy theory as it applies to the food pyramid- I will stick with carbohydrate until I see overwhelming evidence in a healthy population to contradict it.

Well, this is the diet prescribed for diabetes (type 2) by the ADA:

Utter nonsense.

You’re not gonna find large populatioons eating low carb since the agr/ind revolution, a tiny drop of time in the course of human history. However, tests can be done showing why high carbs and low saturated fat is bad and are being done.

Its not a conspiracy - more just greed and stupidity.

The whole foundation of the low fat/high carb theory is built on lies and shaky science.

But thats ok - lets all be dangerously overweight in 20 years!

Yeah!

One other thing, although I think Rosedale is on the money with the crappy grain fed beef or soy fed fish, which creates a meat with much a much different nutritional profile than natural dieted anmals, saturated fat has always been a large part of the diet of primitive peoples. Animals living on a natural diet - natural to them still have saturated fat quantity. Its not like grain fed beef but its there. Some animals were delibrately hunted for their fat. They would actually take the fat right off their backs and consume just this leaving the rest of the meat to rot with some animals. But he does seem to think fat is very important so I guess he means maybe this aftificially created fat through improper animal diet. They get fat just like us on the unnatural high grain diet.

So newbie, we take all the grain fields and start producing ethanol which would relieve our dependence on foreign oil, then we let cattle and poultry “free range” on all of our federal land, including the parks??